Compatibility with IBM APL 
Author Message
 Compatibility with IBM APL

I have a bunch of workspaces that were created on a couple of
different APL systems (I think one of them was APL*PLUS, and
the other was something on the Apple).  After I moved here I
no longer have access to either of these systems but do have
the workspaces on a diskette. The APL I am now using is the IBM
APL on the PC/AT. My problem ??

Well, I can't find ANY way of getting the IBM version to recognize
or access my older workspaces. After delving thru the manual, it
appears that this package will use ONLY workspaces created ON IT.
Is there any way around this disgusting situation, or can I
peacefully consign my workspaces to the trash can ?

Please e-mail or reply to the net if anyone out there has any
suggestions . Thanks....

***************************************************************



*****************************************************************



Mon, 19 Apr 1993 18:26:00 GMT  
 Compatibility with IBM APL

Quote:
>I have a bunch of workspaces that were created on a couple of
>different APL systems (I think one of them was APL*PLUS, and
>the other was something on the Apple).

I think that your new APL can read a file.

Borrow a machine with your old APL on it (STSC's APL*PLUS is very popular,
and is surely in use there in Pittsburgh).  Use it to create a file that
follows the WorkSpace Interchange Standard (WSIS).  This can be ported
to your new APL.

Then, using your new APL, read the WSIS file.  Re-construct the Canonical
Representation Vectors (CRVs) for your variables and functions.  A next
important step is to use Quad-FX to ``fix'' your functions from the CRVs.

Several variations on WSIS have been used, such as those in use by
Selfridge in Florida and Way in Cleveland.  Some APLs have built in
WSIS functions and commands or have supplied workspaces to help out.
For instance, if you were using an Apple II, you were probably using
Vanguard APL, and I know that Cory Skutt, while working for them, did
work on WSIS.

APL2 from IBM includes system commands ``)IN'' and ``)OUT'' and a
new Quad function called ``Quad-TF'' (for Transfer Form) which can
help you with WSIS.

The British APL Association has an APL software exchange that includes
WSIS workspaces that were written by Richard Naugle of Wayland, Massachusetts.
The organizing committee APL89 is planning to run a software
exchange at APL89, and I think they will include WSIS workspaces.

OK?

--
    L. J.{*filter*}ey, Faculty of Mathematics, University of Waterloo.





Mon, 19 Apr 1993 13:41:00 GMT  
 Compatibility with IBM APL

Is APL a dying language?



Mon, 19 Apr 1993 15:32:00 GMT  
 Compatibility with IBM APL

Quote:

>Is APL a dying language?

Not for me it's not!  I was first exposed to APL on an old IBM 5100 "portable"
computer over a decade ago.  Since then it has remained my language of choice.
I'm a mathematician by training and find APL the most natural tool for express-
ing and implementing my ideas.  Prototyping is extremely rapid, and once one
gets used to it APL is quite "readable" and maintainable.

Modern versions such as IBM's APL2 or Dyalog APL which implement nested arrays,
user-defined operators and similar extensions are extremely powerful languages
capable of both numerical and symbolic processing of great generality.  Within
IBM many people are using APL2 in their AI work.  I've done a fair amount of
Lisp programming myself and would be hard-pressed to find a example of some-
thing in Lisp that would be more difficult to implement in APL2.

Right now I'm using Dyalog APL.  It's optimized for a UNIX environment, and,
unlike many APL's, it is easy to link in external routines and escape to
the operating system when you need to.  

==============================================================================
|Dr. Robert J. Frey               | {icus, spl1, dasys1}!acsm!kepler1!rjfrey |
|Kepler Financial Management, Ltd.|------------------------------------------|
|100 North Country Rd., Bldg. B   | The views expressed are wholly my own and|
|Setauket, NY  11766              | and do not reflect those of the Indepen- |
|(516) 689-6300 x.16              | dent Republic of Latvia.                 |
==============================================================================



Mon, 19 Apr 1993 09:01:00 GMT  
 Compatibility with IBM APL

Quote:

> Is APL a dying language?

In summary, NO.

Big APL users include Insurance and Casuality companies, Banking, and
Astronomers.  

I may be biased, though, as I am a big fan of APL.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------
Any statements made above are my personal opinion and may not shared by
my current or past employers.  ( feel free to zero rho my response )

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|
|      {ames,apple,portal,sun,voder}!claris!madmax!max   [home system]
|

\---------------------------------------------------------------------/
.



Mon, 19 Apr 1993 21:11:00 GMT  
 Compatibility with IBM APL

Quote:

>Is APL a dying language?

I doubt it.  I have a quandry in my work.  I'm the only one here who knows
APL, so anything that can possibly be done in PC-type modelling environments
gets done there.  The really hard stuff gets done in APL.

I've heard that the broadcast news services and pollsters were all using
APL based software to analyze election and poll results this year.  Sounds
like an ideal application to me.

--
Daniel A. Graifer                       Franklin Capital Investments
uunet!fciva!dag                         7900 Westpark Drive, Suite A130
(703)821-3244                           McLean, VA  22102



Mon, 19 Apr 1993 13:44:00 GMT  
 Compatibility with IBM APL
(I posted this earlier but all the replies subsequently were lost due to
an overflowing file system.)
Is there anywhere a complete listing of the WSIS?  I wish to move
workspaces from STSC APL*PLUS on a Mac Plus to APL.68000 on a Mac II.
The former has )import and )export system commands which generate
WSIS text files.  APL.68000 has no equivalent command or utility
workspaces.  Is there a complete listing of the WSIS functions
somewhere? I have the original article, but it gives only a partial
listing.  If I have missed something here, please feel free to correct
me.  Thanks,
-------------------
Simon Tortike, Department of Mining, Metallurgical and Petroleum Engineering,
The University of Alberta, Edmonton, AB, CANADA T6G 2G6.



Mon, 19 Apr 1993 04:21:00 GMT  
 Compatibility with IBM APL

APL may not be dying, but STSC has refused to commit itself to
upgrading its APL*PLUS for the Macintosh so it will work on a Mac II.
If you read the usual Mac user magazines you will almost never see
a mention of any APL for the Mac.



Mon, 19 Apr 1993 02:31:00 GMT  
 Compatibility with IBM APL
[please pardon my flames as I do not hold the mac to be a sacred cow]

[oh, and btw, if anyone could recommend a good apl for the mac...]

Quote:

>APL may not be dying, but STSC has refused to commit itself to
>upgrading its APL*PLUS for the Macintosh so it will work on a Mac II.

Could it be that some other company has stolen their mac programming
talent?  In my last job search, I found a number of shops that were proud of
raiding "Entire departments" from other companies.

In short, if your program doesn't work on a Mac2 or under Multifinder,
you're breaking the rules (such as writing directly into the screen).
Programs that do this aren't "too hard" to do upgrades.  [STSC: I do take
contracts.]

Quote:
>If you read the usual Mac user magazines you will almost never see
>a mention of any APL for the Mac.

Of course not, it doesn't have anything to do with Hypercard, Microsoft
Word, Bill Atkinson or Jean-Louis Gasse'e.  The mac magazines don't give a
hoot about Real Programming or even Real Programming Tools.  The only decent
programming resource is MacTutor.  
--
for those of you who don't trust the headers:



Mon, 19 Apr 1993 17:25:00 GMT  
 Compatibility with IBM APL

Quote:

> APL may not be dying, but STSC has refused to commit itself to
> upgrading its APL*PLUS for the Macintosh so it will work on a Mac II.
> If you read the usual Mac user magazines you will almost never see
> a mention of any APL for the Mac.

There are two reasons that STSC has refused to commit to upgrading APL*PLUS
for the Macintosh.  The first reason is that they bought another Mac APL
added some of the APL*PLUS features and called it APL*PLUS.  I don't know
if they have the source code to update.  The second and more important
reason is that STSC was bought out a while ago and not very interested in the
APL end-user community.  If you want to time-share and buy services from them
they are very interested in you.  STSC isn't the same company it was years
ago ( but then again, neither is most any company in the computer industry).
Al Rose left long ago.  

I just hope that IP SHARPE comes out with a Macintosh APL.

(All the opinions expressed above are mine and do not represent my current
 employer, my past employer, or any future employers.)

Max Rochlin
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|      {ames,apple,portal,sun,voder}!claris!madmax!max   [home system]

\---------------------------------------------------------------------/



Mon, 19 Apr 1993 19:34:00 GMT  
 Compatibility with IBM APL
perhaps a more interesting question:

Is APL a growing language?  A good metric would be:
How many people do you know who have STARTED using APL in the past 5 years?

I suspect that current users STARTED using APL during its heyday
(as measured by attendance at APL conferences) -- 1976-1983.

/Bob



Mon, 19 Apr 1993 19:42:00 GMT  
 Compatibility with IBM APL

Quote:

>APL may not be dying, but STSC has refused to commit itself to
>upgrading its APL*PLUS for the Macintosh...

I think that's unfortunate, but APL is STSC's main product, so I wouldn't
assume that this is a reflection of their assessment of the APL market in
general.  Right now STSC is heavily involved in its APL products for
MS-DOS and its UNIX-based APL.  They may not want to spread themselves too
thinly.

Any comments from someone at STSC?

==============================================================================
|Dr. Robert J. Frey               | {icus, spl1, dasys1}!acsm!kepler1!rjfrey |
|Kepler Financial Management, Ltd.|------------------------------------------|
|100 North Country Rd., Bldg. B   | The views expressed are wholly my own and|
|Setauket, NY  11766              | and do not reflect those of the Indepen- |
|(516) 689-6300 x.16              | dent Republic of Latvia.                 |
==============================================================================



Mon, 19 Apr 1993 20:08:00 GMT  
 
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