RESULT: comp.lang.python.announce moderated passes 227:15 
Author Message
 RESULT: comp.lang.python.announce moderated passes 227:15

                                RESULT
       moderated group comp.lang.python.announce passes 227:15

There were 227 YES votes and 15 NO votes, for a total of 242 valid votes.
There were 2 abstains.

For group passage, YES votes must be at least 2/3 of all valid (YES and NO)
votes.   There also must be at least 100 more YES votes than NO votes.
comp.lang.python.announce passed on Sat Feb 14 21:56:47 1998.

There is a five day discussion period after these results are posted.  If no
serious allegations of voting irregularities are raised, the moderator of
news.announce.newgroups will create the group shortly thereafter.

Newsgroups line:
comp.lang.python.announce       Announcements about the python language. (Moderated)

This vote was conducted by a neutral third party.  Questions about the
proposed group should be directed to the proponent.



RATIONALE: comp.lang.python.announce

Traffic on comp.lang.python has grown to the point where readers would
benefit from a separate newsgroup just for announcements.  Moderating
the newsgroup would ensure that it was low-volume.  General discussion
of Python would continue on the unmoderated newsgroup comp.lang.python.

CHARTER: comp.lang.python.announce

Comp.lang.python.announce is a moderated, low-volume newsgroup for
announcements regarding the Python programming language, including:

  - new releases of the core distribution and contributed software
  - events (user group meetings, conferences, training, etc.)
  - periodic postings (FAQs)
  - other items of general interest to the Python community

This is not a discussion group.  Posts are expected to have
Followup-To: headers set to "poster" or an appropriate newsgroup;
posts that omit this header will have a Followup-To: comp.lang.python
inserted by the moderator.

END CHARTER.

MODERATOR INFO: comp.lang.python.announce





END MODERATOR INFO.

comp.lang.python.announce Final Vote Ack

Voted Yes
------------------------------------------------------------------------------



































































































...

read more »



Wed, 23 Aug 2000 03:00:00 GMT  
 RESULT: comp.lang.python.announce moderated passes 227:15

Quote:

> I am wondering, why did the following people vote NO?    And who the
> hell is d?   Looks like a fake vote to me.   d said no.   Yeah right.

...

Ok, I love to see that the vote went through and the new group will
exist.
But I don't love to see a public list of people who said "No"!
Is that way to expose people because of their private decision to the
public?
I don't believe this is correct. This is a vote, no inquisition.

astonished - pirx

--

Applied Biometrics GmbH      :     Have a break! Take a ride on Python's
Kaiserin-Augusta-Allee 101   :    *Starship* http://starship.skyport.net
10553 Berlin                 :     PGP key -> http://pgpkeys.mit.edu
     we're tired of banana software - shipped green, ripens at home



Thu, 24 Aug 2000 03:00:00 GMT  
 RESULT: comp.lang.python.announce moderated passes 227:15

: I don't believe this is correct. This is a vote, no inquisition.

Nobody expects the Spanish Inquisition....



Thu, 24 Aug 2000 03:00:00 GMT  
 RESULT: comp.lang.python.announce moderated passes 227:15

Quote:
Christian Tismer writes:
>Ok, I love to see that the vote went through and the new group will
>exist.
>But I don't love to see a public list of people who said "No"!
>Is that way to expose people because of their private decision to the
>public?

        That's the way Usenet voting has been carried out for years.
However, don't conclude that those 15 people harbor some grudge
against Python; some people vote "No" on every newsgroup proposal
because they think Usenet is getting too large.  

Quote:
>I don't believe this is correct. This is a vote, no inquisition.

        Nobody expects the... oh, you know the rest.

A.M. Kuchling                   http://starship.skyport.net/crew/amk/
There's nothing remarkable about it. All one has to do is hit the right keys
at the right time and the instrument plays itself.
        -- Johann Sebastian Bach



Thu, 24 Aug 2000 03:00:00 GMT  
 RESULT: comp.lang.python.announce moderated passes 227:15

Hello.

Quote:

> > I am wondering, why did the following people vote NO?    And who the

   I loose the original postings; I want to explain why I voted NO.
   There was nothing againts Python - I love Python. It is language I am
using. It is the only language I am using during 1.5 years (after
Pascal,
C, C++, assemblers and perl).
   But the situation in c.l.p is bad. The language and the interpreter
are forgotten. The entire newsgroup is filled with message on Python+Tk,
or (even worse) "I have problems installing PythonWin".
   I am not saying that tkinter or pythonwin are evils (though I -
personnaly - think they are :). But c.l.p.a is not the solution for me.
I
don't want yet another c.l.p. I want to split the newsgroup into
   comp.lang.python (core - the language and the interpreter)
   comp.lang.python.windows
   comp.lang.python.tk
It would be much better (IMHO).

Oleg.
----

           Programmers don't die, they just GOSUB without RETURN.



Fri, 25 Aug 2000 03:00:00 GMT  
 RESULT: comp.lang.python.announce moderated passes 227:15

Quote:

> ...
>   But the situation in c.l.p is bad. The language and the interpreter
>are forgotten. The entire newsgroup is filled with message on Python+Tk,
>or (even worse) "I have problems installing PythonWin".
>   I am not saying that tkinter or pythonwin are evils (though I -
>personnaly - think they are :). But c.l.p.a is not the solution for me.
>I
>don't want yet another c.l.p. I want to split the newsgroup into
>   comp.lang.python (core - the language and the interpreter)
>   comp.lang.python.windows
>   comp.lang.python.tk

Your logic escapes me - Did you not read the CFV or the CHARTER section in
the msg that started this thread?

c.l.p.a is a _moderated_ group for _announcements only_.  As such, it can
only _help_ the very situation you are complaining about, by removing the
bulk of the announcement msgs to another group, and by moderating that
group so it isn't overgrown with spam and general issues.

Since Python is such a nice cross-platform solution, without c.l.p.a those
announcements would likely be posted to at least two, if not all, of the
groups you have proposed, rather than in a single c.l.p.a group.  And since
so much of Python is the same across all platforms and apps, splitting
c.l.p into multiple "focus" groups is by no means a "solution" to the
"evils" you object to (and which, IMHO, are a gross over-exaggeration of
the state of the c.l.p.a group - if you are such a Python fan and
interested in only such focused discussion topics, have you expressed your
interest by joining the PSA?).

----------------------------------------------



Fri, 25 Aug 2000 03:00:00 GMT  
 RESULT: comp.lang.python.announce moderated passes 227:15

Quote:
Oleg Broytmann writes:
>   But the situation in c.l.p is bad. The language and the interpreter
>are forgotten. The entire newsgroup is filled with message on Python+Tk,
>or (even worse) "I have problems installing PythonWin".

        To some degree, that's because of lack of documentation.
Python+Tk and PythonWin are complicated products that have not yet
attracted a corresponding mass of documentation; as more books and Web
pages get written, the questions will shift and become more advanced.
There are also lots of questions about system issues such as socket
programming, which aren't precisely Python-related, but are easiest to
ask here and aren't common enough to annoy people.

        It also seems to me that there's relatively little to discuss
about the core, because Python is such a simple language.  While it
has some sharp edges (you can play confusing namespace games, and
writing complicated extensions is, well, complicated) there are
relatively few of them, and few of us seem to use them in very
complicated ways, though Jim Fulton does a lot of work at those sharp
edges.  

        Of course, there are numerous open questions for *future*
development, as can be attested by anyone who attended the developers'
day at the last conference, but they don't seem to be the focus of
much discussion at the moment.  

A.M. Kuchling                   http://starship.skyport.net/crew/amk/
All that is human must retrograde if it do not advance.
        -- Edward Gibbon



Sat, 26 Aug 2000 03:00:00 GMT  
 
 [ 7 post ] 

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