ANN: New Visual Fortran Product Survey 
Author Message
 ANN: New Visual Fortran Product Survey

I am doing a pricing survey for a new fortran compiler product targeted
at Visual Studio 2005.  I would like to invite members of this group to
share their opinion.  The survey takes less than five minutes and all
respondents can remain anonymous.  Optionally, if you're comfortable
sharing your name and email address, you can enter a drawing to win one
of 25 copies of  "Fortran 99/2003 Explained" by Michael Metcalf, et.al.
 All responses are confidential and you will not be contacted.

To help avoid bias, the company funding the survey wishes to remain
anonymous. The survey is on the web at:

      http://www.*-*-*.com/

Regards,
Pat Brooks



Wed, 24 Dec 2008 02:58:21 GMT  
 ANN: New Visual Fortran Product Survey

Quote:
>I am doing a pricing survey for a new Fortran compiler product targeted
> at Visual Studio 2005.  I would like to invite members of this group to
> share their opinion.  The survey takes less than five minutes and all
> respondents can remain anonymous.  Optionally, if you're comfortable
> sharing your name and email address, you can enter a drawing to win one
> of 25 copies of  "Fortran 99/2003 Explained" by Michael Metcalf, et.al.
> All responses are confidential and you will not be contacted.

> To help avoid bias, the company funding the survey wishes to remain
> anonymous. The survey is on the web at:

>     http://www.surveymonkey.com/s.asp?u=648352245739

> Regards,
> Pat Brooks

Are there any prizes for guessing it's The Portland Group,
or is that too easy?

Ian.



Wed, 24 Dec 2008 21:13:51 GMT  
 ANN: New Visual Fortran Product Survey

Quote:

>>     http://www.surveymonkey.com/s.asp?u=648352245739

> Are there any prizes for guessing it's The Portland Group,
> or is that too easy?

Upon completion of the survey, it brought up a Google search with their
site at the top.  Not so anonymous.


Wed, 24 Dec 2008 22:54:54 GMT  
 ANN: New Visual Fortran Product Survey

Quote:

>> Are there any prizes for guessing it's The Portland Group,
>> or is that too easy?

> Upon completion of the survey, it brought up a Google search with their
> site at the top.  Not so anonymous.

OK, I was going by the OP's header:
X-HTTP-Via: 1.1 mango.pgroup.com:8080

Not really anonymous at all!



Wed, 24 Dec 2008 23:30:59 GMT  
 ANN: New Visual Fortran Product Survey


Quote:


>>I am doing a pricing survey for a new Fortran compiler product targeted
>> at Visual Studio 2005.  I would like to invite members of this group to
>> share their opinion.  The survey takes less than five minutes and all
>> respondents can remain anonymous.  Optionally, if you're comfortable
>> sharing your name and email address, you can enter a drawing to win one
>> of 25 copies of  "Fortran 99/2003 Explained" by Michael Metcalf, et.al.
>> All responses are confidential and you will not be contacted.

>> To help avoid bias, the company funding the survey wishes to remain
>> anonymous. The survey is on the web at:

>>     http://www.*-*-*.com/

> Are there any prizes for guessing it's The Portland Group,
> or is that too easy?

I was going to ignore this adverti{*filter*}t until you identified
a likely company.  I used an older version of PG's linux compiler.
Based on that experience, I can't recommend their product.

--
Steve
http://www.*-*-*.com/ ~kargl/



Thu, 25 Dec 2008 00:05:39 GMT  
 ANN: New Visual Fortran Product Survey
Quote:



>>I am doing a pricing survey for a new Fortran compiler product targeted
>>at Visual Studio 2005.  I would like to invite members of this group to
>>share their opinion.  The survey takes less than five minutes and all
>>respondents can remain anonymous.  Optionally, if you're comfortable
>>sharing your name and email address, you can enter a drawing to win one
>>of 25 copies of  "Fortran 99/2003 Explained" by Michael Metcalf, et.al.
>>All responses are confidential and you will not be contacted.

>>To help avoid bias, the company funding the survey wishes to remain
>>anonymous. The survey is on the web at:

>>    http://www.surveymonkey.com/s.asp?u=648352245739

>>Regards,
>>Pat Brooks

> Are there any prizes for guessing it's The Portland Group,
> or is that too easy?

I still don't see how they can call it "visial fortran".  Isn't that
trademarked already?  MS sure wouldn't allow somebody to put out a
visual something that they produce without a $ fight.

Quote:
> Ian.

--

Gary Scott

Fortran Library:  http://www.fortranlib.com

Support the Original G95 Project:  http://www.g95.org
-OR-
Support the GNU GFortran Project:  http://gcc.gnu.org/fortran/index.html

Why are there two?  God only knows.

If you want to do the impossible, don't hire an expert because he knows
it can't be done.

-- Henry Ford



Thu, 25 Dec 2008 00:42:47 GMT  
 ANN: New Visual Fortran Product Survey

Quote:




>>> I am doing a pricing survey for a new Fortran compiler product targeted
>>> at Visual Studio 2005.  I would like to invite members of this group to
>>> share their opinion.  The survey takes less than five minutes and all
>>> respondents can remain anonymous.  Optionally, if you're comfortable
>>> sharing your name and email address, you can enter a drawing to win one
>>> of 25 copies of  "Fortran 99/2003 Explained" by Michael Metcalf, et.al.
>>> All responses are confidential and you will not be contacted.

>>> To help avoid bias, the company funding the survey wishes to remain
>>> anonymous. The survey is on the web at:

>>>    http://www.surveymonkey.com/s.asp?u=648352245739

>>> Regards,
>>> Pat Brooks

>> Are there any prizes for guessing it's The Portland Group,
>> or is that too easy?

> I still don't see how they can call it "visial fortran".  

argh "visual"...

Isn't that

- Show quoted text -

Quote:
> trademarked already?  MS sure wouldn't allow somebody to put out a
> visual something that they produce without a $ fight.

>> Ian.



Thu, 25 Dec 2008 00:43:44 GMT  
 ANN: New Visual Fortran Product Survey

Quote:


>>>    http://www.surveymonkey.com/s.asp?u=648352245739

>>Are there any prizes for guessing it's The Portland Group,
>>or is that too easy?

> Upon completion of the survey, it brought up a Google search with their
> site at the top.  Not so anonymous.

Well, it _was_ a Google search just on the word "Fortran", so I didn't
really think that was especially significant.

- Brooks

--
The "bmoses-nospam" address is valid; no unmunging needed.



Thu, 25 Dec 2008 00:51:10 GMT  
 ANN: New Visual Fortran Product Survey

Quote:

> I still don't see how they can call it "visial fortran".  Isn't that
> trademarked already?  MS sure wouldn't allow somebody to put out a
> visual something that they produce without a $ fight.

There is at least one commercial Visual Fortran out already:

http://www.intel.com/cd/software/products/asmo-na/eng/compilers/27883...

Version 9.1 is for Visual Studio 2005.  I imagine Intel would object as
much as Microsoft.



Thu, 25 Dec 2008 10:45:39 GMT  
 ANN: New Visual Fortran Product Survey

Quote:


>>I still don't see how they can call it "visial fortran".  Isn't that
>>trademarked already?  MS sure wouldn't allow somebody to put out a
>>visual something that they produce without a $ fight.

> There is at least one commercial Visual Fortran out already:

> http://www.intel.com/cd/software/products/asmo-na/eng/compilers/27883...

> Version 9.1 is for Visual Studio 2005.  I imagine Intel would object as
> much as Microsoft.

That's what I meant.  I assume that MS authorized DEC to use the name,
and that that authorization transferred to Compaq/HP and then to Intel
(don't know that) when the compiler/components/rights were successively
purchased by those companies.  So I'd assume that the trademark belongs
to Intel (unless Compaq/HP retained it, but I doubt that since they
aren't using it).  It is also strange to me that Portland thinks that it
can compete and provide a better product than Lahey, Absoft, and Intel
(and Salford/Silverfrost and Pathscale and ...). (meaning aren't there
enough already?)

--

Gary Scott

Fortran Library:  http://www.fortranlib.com

Support the Original G95 Project:  http://www.g95.org
-OR-
Support the GNU GFortran Project:  http://gcc.gnu.org/fortran/index.html

Why are there two?  God only knows.

If you want to do the impossible, don't hire an expert because he knows
it can't be done.

-- Henry Ford



Thu, 25 Dec 2008 11:13:51 GMT  
 ANN: New Visual Fortran Product Survey
Quote:



>>> I still don't see how they can call it "visial fortran".  Isn't that
>>> trademarked already?  MS sure wouldn't allow somebody to put out a
>>> visual something that they produce without a $ fight.

>> There is at least one commercial Visual Fortran out already:

>> http://www.intel.com/cd/software/products/asmo-na/eng/compilers/27883...

>> Version 9.1 is for Visual Studio 2005.  I imagine Intel would object as
>> much as Microsoft.

> That's what I meant.  I assume that MS authorized DEC to use the name,
> and that that authorization transferred to Compaq/HP and then to Intel
> (don't know that) when the compiler/components/rights were successively
> purchased by those companies.  So I'd assume that the trademark belongs
> to Intel (unless Compaq/HP retained it, but I doubt that since they
> aren't using it).  It is also strange to me that Portland thinks that it
> can compete and provide a better product than Lahey, Absoft, and Intel
> (and Salford/Silverfrost and Pathscale and ...). (meaning aren't there
> enough already?)

I work for one of those companies, and I have no idea what the answer
is, beyond the public information, which is often misquoted.  HP does
own and retain the rights to DEC/Compaq Visual Fortran, and their disuse
of it does not give anyone else a right to use it. Nor did Microsoft
extend the agreement under which CVF was developed to any other successor.
Microsoft exercises a great deal of control over any integration of 3rd
party compilers with Visual Studio, and it seems they may have
negotiated a change in the rules again in this case. Those rules tend to
restrict what kind of debugging facilities will be available etc etc.  I
have no idea whether HP may have been a party to the naming or
development of this product.
I might guess that PGI (as it appears to be responsible according to
posted headers) has backing from certain hardware vendors.  I believe
the wording which says the product is only for Windows X64 EM64T and
AMD64, for which only a minority of the vendors mentioned above have a
product.
If I believe the most recent report that only 4% of licensed Windows
copies are 64-bit (and I've never been offered a pirated 64-bit
Windows), it does seem like a confined market.  I suspect (as catalog
listings appear to confirm) a vast majority of 64-bit capable computers
are sold with 32-bit Windows installed, with the customer having no idea
of the 64-bit option.  I'll let others guess whether another available
Fortran compiler will change that.


Thu, 25 Dec 2008 13:42:41 GMT  
 ANN: New Visual Fortran Product Survey

Quote:




>>>> I still don't see how they can call it "visial fortran".  Isn't that
>>>> trademarked already?  MS sure wouldn't allow somebody to put out a
>>>> visual something that they produce without a $ fight.

>>> There is at least one commercial Visual Fortran out already:

>>> http://www.*-*-*.com/

>>> Version 9.1 is for Visual Studio 2005.  I imagine Intel would object as
>>> much as Microsoft.

>> That's what I meant.  I assume that MS authorized DEC to use the name,
>> and that that authorization transferred to Compaq/HP and then to Intel
>> (don't know that) when the compiler/components/rights were
>> successively purchased by those companies.  So I'd assume that the
>> trademark belongs to Intel (unless Compaq/HP retained it, but I doubt
>> that since they aren't using it).  It is also strange to me that
>> Portland thinks that it can compete and provide a better product than
>> Lahey, Absoft, and Intel (and Salford/Silverfrost and Pathscale and
>> ...). (meaning aren't there enough already?)

> I work for one of those companies, and I have no idea what the answer
> is, beyond the public information, which is often misquoted.  HP does
> own and retain the rights to DEC/Compaq Visual Fortran, and their disuse
> of it does not give anyone else a right to use it. Nor did Microsoft
> extend the agreement under which CVF was developed to any other successor.
> Microsoft exercises a great deal of control over any integration of 3rd
> party compilers with Visual Studio, and it seems they may have
> negotiated a change in the rules again in this case. Those rules tend to
> restrict what kind of debugging facilities will be available etc etc.  I
> have no idea whether HP may have been a party to the naming or
> development of this product.
> I might guess that PGI (as it appears to be responsible according to
> posted headers) has backing from certain hardware vendors.  I believe
> the wording which says the product is only for Windows X64 EM64T and
> AMD64, for which only a minority of the vendors mentioned above have a
> product.
> If I believe the most recent report that only 4% of licensed Windows
> copies are 64-bit (and I've never been offered a pirated 64-bit
> Windows), it does seem like a confined market.  I suspect (as catalog
> listings appear to confirm) a vast majority of 64-bit capable computers
> are sold with 32-bit Windows installed, with the customer having no idea
> of the 64-bit option.  I'll let others guess whether another available
> Fortran compiler will change that.

I would expect most of the above vendors to produce such a compiler for
whatever architecture becomes pre{*filter*}, eventually.

--

Gary Scott

Fortran Library:   http://www.*-*-*.com/

Support the Original G95 Project:   http://www.*-*-*.com/
-OR-
Support the GNU GFortran Project:   http://www.*-*-*.com/

Why are there two?  God only knows.

If you want to do the impossible, don't hire an expert because he knows
it can't be done.

-- Henry Ford



Fri, 26 Dec 2008 03:24:36 GMT  
 ANN: New Visual Fortran Product Survey

Quote:



>> Are there any prizes for guessing it's The Portland Group,
>> or is that too easy?

> I was going to ignore this adverti{*filter*}t until you identified
> a likely company.  I used an older version of PG's linux compiler.
> Based on that experience, I can't recommend their product.

Seconded,

Ian



Fri, 26 Dec 2008 17:52:36 GMT  
 ANN: New Visual Fortran Product Survey

Quote:




> >> Are there any prizes for guessing it's The Portland Group,
> >> or is that too easy?

> > I was going to ignore this adverti{*filter*}t until you identified
> > a likely company.  I used an older version of PG's linux compiler.
> > Based on that experience, I can't recommend their product.

> Seconded,

> Ian

I should first say that I haven't exercised PGI's fortran compiler as
much as their C compiler. However, I have found their C compiler to be
quite good and their fortran compiler seems to work fine. One reason we
tried their product is we have to target windows and linux and a large
processor base is AMD's (have heard some bad things about intel
compilers on amd processors). We looked at pathscale, but they didn't
offer windows compilers. Absoft was strictly fortran and we needed
C/C++ more than fortran. Additionally, their openmp support works well
too. Anyways, I'm not saying their fortran compiler is the best, just
saying it's worked in all of our code.


Fri, 26 Dec 2008 19:38:46 GMT  
 
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