Opinions on TERSE please? 
Author Message
 Opinions on TERSE please?

Has anyone tried the Terse language?  I would like to hear some
opinions....

Get the FAQs http://www.*-*-*.com/ ~raymoon/x86faqs.html



Sat, 26 Jul 2003 12:24:19 GMT  
 Opinions on TERSE please?


Quote:

> Has anyone tried the Terse language?  I would like to hear some
> opinions....

Try to get a copy of the free, and apparently improved, clone, Nega.

Robert
--
Robert AH Prins

Sent via Deja.com
http://www.deja.com



Mon, 28 Jul 2003 21:29:51 GMT  
 Opinions on TERSE please?



Quote:


> > Has anyone tried the Terse language?  I would like to hear some
> > opinions....

> Try to get a copy of the free, and apparently improved, clone, Nega.

"Improved" in what sense?
While I applaud people who provide free software to the programming
community, and often use this free stuff myself, there are some clear
problems with free software (especially fringe stuff like a TERSE-clone).
Specifically, documentation and support.  You have to be awfully poor
(or exceedingly cheap) not to be able to afford the $50 that Jim Neil
is asking for TERSE.  Jim supports his product and the documentation
is not bad.  He provides lots of sample code and is willing to answer
questions about TERSE.  He's ported it to several different assemblers
and operating systems.

If Nega is the product I'm thinking of, I have some problems with it.
First, Nega (or a similar program) was written because someone(s) in
CLAX got pissed off that Jim Neil was trying to "make some money"
off "such a simple language."  So they wrote their own free compiler
just to put an end to that.  Quite frankly, I don't have a whole lot of
respect for such motivation.  While I haven't followed this product
(Nega or whatever) since its inception, my suspicion is that it
was a "proof of concept" application.  Once they proved you didn't
have to purchase TERSE they were on to bigger and better things.
My suspicion (and I would love to be corrected on this if I'm wrong)
is that Nega (or whatever) hasn't been maintained anywhere near
the level of TERSE (if at all).  So I would really question the comment
about "improved" above (again, I don't know anything about Nega,
I'm making some wild assertions that I suspect to be correct here, but
have no proof one way or the other).  Now Nega may be much better
than TERSE, I don't know, but I'm impressed by what I've seen of
Jim's efforts and this is the first I've heard of Nega after hundreds of
hours scouring the net for assembly language info.

One very negative bit of feedback from the Nega (or whatever)
debacle was the loss of an enthusiastic expert here in CLAX.
Some people complain about my over-promotion of HLA in
this newsgroup.  I've even suggested (tongue in cheek, of course)
that Beth learn from the master.  Well trust me, *I* learned from
the master and the master was Jim Neil.  Jim used to push TERSE
every chance he got in this newsgroup.  Anytime someone had
a question about an algorithm, he'd give a TERSE solution
(and, the corresponding MASM code that TERSE would emit).
His feedback was a valuable addition to this newsgroup.

Then some body(ies) got pissed at this overpromotion and decided
to do him in by producing a TERSE clone and giving it away for
free.  Everytime someone would post a question that Jim would
answer, there'd be a follow up remark about how you could get
a free copy of the TERSE clone elsewhere.  Guess what?
Jim stopped participating in this newsgroup and we lost a wealth
of good advice.  This pisses *me* off and is why I have so little
respect for this TERSE clone (be it Nega or something else).
The program is probably fine (though I doubt it's been maintained),
but the whole purpose for its existence and subsequent "marketing"
is totally offensive to me.

As I said, I learned from "Master Jim" how to promote HLA around
here and still have justification for the posts (as opposed to blatant
ads).  One other thing I learned was to create a very complex
language that someone wouldn't be able to clone in a few weeks :-)
At  about 200,000 lines of code, I don't think anyone will
be cloning the HLA system anytime soon :-).  Of course, it also
helps that HLA is free so the fact that I'm not making any money
off this staves off that offense (though I could never understand
why someone would have a problem with an individual making
money off that individual's own work).
Randy Hyde



Tue, 29 Jul 2003 08:12:49 GMT  
 Opinions on TERSE please?
 From what Randy says, that doesn't sound like fair play to me at all...

For instance, if I charge for the "BethTool" (we'll assume that everyone
likes the tool and finds it useful and it does all the things I've hyped it
to do ;), then would someone here try to undercut me with a free "clone"?

The decision on whether I'll charge for it depends entirely on the eventual
quality of the product...but, my point here is, would you try to make a free
clone of it? Because, if so, then I would have to strongly reconsider
bothering to releasing it at all...

So, you won't even have the luxury of knowing what it's all about and seeing
all that theory I've spouted in practice...I'd rather not do this because I
believe it would help a lot of people greatly but I might be forced into
this choice...

I'll explain, shall I?

It's this simple...if I do charge for it, it is for one reason and one
reason only...not to get rich or seek massive fame or any such BS like
that...it is because I'm currently considering "going it alone" and trying
to make a living and, hopefully, build up a business that way...nothing
fantastical here, just the ability to be able to make a living off doing
what I like to do rather than some BS someone else wants...just to be my own
Boss, is all...

If someone were to make a free clone of anything I've made then, basically,
this has the potential to ruin lives...whether you thought of that or
not...sounds melodramatic?

Maybe...but it's more than possible...just because there are people out
there who _are_ overcharging to make themselves rich and fat, doesn't mean
that everyone's out to do this...

If you understand, what you'd be paying for is my ability to be devoted to
the products I would produce and maintain...you'd be paying to allow me to
devote my time and attention to your problems via my products...because, in
a sense, you'd be paying to have me as a {*filter*} employee on your behalf
(as it sounded like Jim Neil was)...if you don't, then I'll have to be a
wage slave to someone else and then, whatever my intentions, I wouldn't have
the opportunity to help and support and develop programming and programmers
in any way I can...which is what I'd like to do...

Basically, just because in your life you may be sitting pretty and, from
your perspective, that charging for basic tools is something you'd rather
not do - you'd rather spend the money on a good night out or something -
does not imply that everyone has such liberties also...

This is also another reason why I didn't like the "big business is a
ruthless cut-throat affair" comments in another post...that's big business
but what about a small business that's trying to start out? With good
products and services...that's not the problem...actually, it's because the
products are good that they get trashed in the first place...this just seems
{*filter*} and malicious - evil, even - for someone whose just trying to start
out a small business...for everyone's benefit, eventually...

It's also a bit short-sighted...if people had paid for TERSE then maybe this
would have given Jim Neil the resources and the time to be able to devote
towards a much better product...maybe "TERSE 2" would have been the miracle
we're all looking for from our tools...maybe, for the sake of a few pints
down the pub, you've just cut your own throat...

If my intended future direction goes the way I'm planning and hoping for,
then it's going to be difficult enough to get by for the initial period
without having someone maliciously ruin the products I'm developing...so, if
anyone would intend to do this, let me know so that I can just trash my
dream of a better life into the trashcan and go back to grovelling to the
boss...

Beth :)



Tue, 29 Jul 2003 23:18:23 GMT  
 Opinions on TERSE please?
A few thoughts:

1) If I were going to make money, I wouldn't do it with some sort of
tool targeted at assembly geeks.  There are only about twelve of us
left, and I suspect Randall's getting pretty old. :-) :-)  This may
tell you that I didn't really follow your earlier posts about this
tool, since maybe that's not what it is.

2) It takes time to make a product, so the time it takes is a barrier
to people stealing your idea, unless of course you ship source.  Even
then, maybe.

3) Consulting makes more money, unless you're my friend who sells Palm
Pilot games.

4) Anyone who's really that interested in scewing you is unlikely to
tip his hand; if he does, he's probably too stupid to{*filter*}you very
hard.  On the other hand, once you publish something, if it's cool it
will likely be copied.  Doesn't matter, if you're still making money
on it.

5) When I have sold software, what sold and what didn't were somewhat
mysterious, and didn't necessarily relate to the time I put into
things, the free availability of alternatives, or anything else.

6) Consulting makes more money.  I said this twice.  It makes way more
than twice as much.



Quote:
> From what Randy says, that doesn't sound like fair play to me at all...

>For instance, if I charge for the "BethTool" (we'll assume that everyone
>likes the tool and finds it useful and it does all the things I've hyped it
>to do ;), then would someone here try to undercut me with a free "clone"?

>The decision on whether I'll charge for it depends entirely on the eventual
>quality of the product...but, my point here is, would you try to make a free
>clone of it? Because, if so, then I would have to strongly reconsider
>bothering to releasing it at all...

>So, you won't even have the luxury of knowing what it's all about and seeing
>all that theory I've spouted in practice...I'd rather not do this because I
>believe it would help a lot of people greatly but I might be forced into
>this choice...

>I'll explain, shall I?

>It's this simple...if I do charge for it, it is for one reason and one
>reason only...not to get rich or seek massive fame or any such BS like
>that...it is because I'm currently considering "going it alone" and trying
>to make a living and, hopefully, build up a business that way...nothing
>fantastical here, just the ability to be able to make a living off doing
>what I like to do rather than some BS someone else wants...just to be my own
>Boss, is all...

>If someone were to make a free clone of anything I've made then, basically,
>this has the potential to ruin lives...whether you thought of that or
>not...sounds melodramatic?

>Maybe...but it's more than possible...just because there are people out
>there who _are_ overcharging to make themselves rich and fat, doesn't mean
>that everyone's out to do this...

>If you understand, what you'd be paying for is my ability to be devoted to
>the products I would produce and maintain...you'd be paying to allow me to
>devote my time and attention to your problems via my products...because, in
>a sense, you'd be paying to have me as a {*filter*} employee on your behalf
>(as it sounded like Jim Neil was)...if you don't, then I'll have to be a
>wage slave to someone else and then, whatever my intentions, I wouldn't have
>the opportunity to help and support and develop programming and programmers
>in any way I can...which is what I'd like to do...

>Basically, just because in your life you may be sitting pretty and, from
>your perspective, that charging for basic tools is something you'd rather
>not do - you'd rather spend the money on a good night out or something -
>does not imply that everyone has such liberties also...

>This is also another reason why I didn't like the "big business is a
>ruthless cut-throat affair" comments in another post...that's big business
>but what about a small business that's trying to start out? With good
>products and services...that's not the problem...actually, it's because the
>products are good that they get trashed in the first place...this just seems
>{*filter*} and malicious - evil, even - for someone whose just trying to start
>out a small business...for everyone's benefit, eventually...

>It's also a bit short-sighted...if people had paid for TERSE then maybe this
>would have given Jim Neil the resources and the time to be able to devote
>towards a much better product...maybe "TERSE 2" would have been the miracle
>we're all looking for from our tools...maybe, for the sake of a few pints
>down the pub, you've just cut your own throat...

>If my intended future direction goes the way I'm planning and hoping for,
>then it's going to be difficult enough to get by for the initial period
>without having someone maliciously ruin the products I'm developing...so, if
>anyone would intend to do this, let me know so that I can just trash my
>dream of a better life into the trashcan and go back to grovelling to the
>boss...

>Beth :)



Wed, 30 Jul 2003 01:52:27 GMT  
 Opinions on TERSE please?

hi,

A lot of people think software is easy to write... but writing it is not the
hard part.  Even huge programs come together with planning, it just takes time.

But the hard part is supporting it after you've written it...  I've spent a
*lot* of time supporting all the stuff I've got on my site and it really takes
an effort talking to people, trying to reproduce bugs, trying to show people how
to use what you've got.  Trying to keep the documentation updated so you can
stave off further communications issues as well.  Over the last few months I've
just gotten so many features request, bug fix requests, and so forth and I just
don't want to keep up with them any more now that I have a full-time job.  But
people who ARE doing that kind of legwork often need money and support.

On kind of an off-note; when I first came across IDA I wanted to use it, but the
version they had as freeware at the time didn't produce output files.  So then I
started cracking it... that one was tough.  But once I realized I was going to
be actually using it more than once I took some money and paid for the current
version; not so much because I needed more than I had with the cracked version
but because I know from experience that good software takes work, and the author
was trying to make a living at it.  Bottom line is I generally pay for software
nowadays because it just makes sense to share what you have with people if they
are helping to make your life work better.  (although I may not be willing to
pay as much for poor-quality software such as win*).

David

Quote:

>  From what Randy says, that doesn't sound like fair play to me at all...

> For instance, if I charge for the "BethTool" (we'll assume that everyone
> likes the tool and finds it useful and it does all the things I've hyped it
> to do ;), then would someone here try to undercut me with a free "clone"?

> The decision on whether I'll charge for it depends entirely on the eventual
> quality of the product...but, my point here is, would you try to make a free
> clone of it? Because, if so, then I would have to strongly reconsider
> bothering to releasing it at all...

> So, you won't even have the luxury of knowing what it's all about and seeing
> all that theory I've spouted in practice...I'd rather not do this because I
> believe it would help a lot of people greatly but I might be forced into
> this choice...

> I'll explain, shall I?

> It's this simple...if I do charge for it, it is for one reason and one
> reason only...not to get rich or seek massive fame or any such BS like
> that...it is because I'm currently considering "going it alone" and trying
> to make a living and, hopefully, build up a business that way...nothing
> fantastical here, just the ability to be able to make a living off doing
> what I like to do rather than some BS someone else wants...just to be my own
> Boss, is all...

> If someone were to make a free clone of anything I've made then, basically,
> this has the potential to ruin lives...whether you thought of that or
> not...sounds melodramatic?

> Maybe...but it's more than possible...just because there are people out
> there who _are_ overcharging to make themselves rich and fat, doesn't mean
> that everyone's out to do this...

> If you understand, what you'd be paying for is my ability to be devoted to
> the products I would produce and maintain...you'd be paying to allow me to
> devote my time and attention to your problems via my products...because, in
> a sense, you'd be paying to have me as a {*filter*} employee on your behalf
> (as it sounded like Jim Neil was)...if you don't, then I'll have to be a
> wage slave to someone else and then, whatever my intentions, I wouldn't have
> the opportunity to help and support and develop programming and programmers
> in any way I can...which is what I'd like to do...

> Basically, just because in your life you may be sitting pretty and, from
> your perspective, that charging for basic tools is something you'd rather
> not do - you'd rather spend the money on a good night out or something -
> does not imply that everyone has such liberties also...

> This is also another reason why I didn't like the "big business is a
> ruthless cut-throat affair" comments in another post...that's big business
> but what about a small business that's trying to start out? With good
> products and services...that's not the problem...actually, it's because the
> products are good that they get trashed in the first place...this just seems
> {*filter*} and malicious - evil, even - for someone whose just trying to start
> out a small business...for everyone's benefit, eventually...

> It's also a bit short-sighted...if people had paid for TERSE then maybe this
> would have given Jim Neil the resources and the time to be able to devote
> towards a much better product...maybe "TERSE 2" would have been the miracle
> we're all looking for from our tools...maybe, for the sake of a few pints
> down the pub, you've just cut your own throat...

> If my intended future direction goes the way I'm planning and hoping for,
> then it's going to be difficult enough to get by for the initial period
> without having someone maliciously ruin the products I'm developing...so, if
> anyone would intend to do this, let me know so that I can just trash my
> dream of a better life into the trashcan and go back to grovelling to the
> boss...

> Beth :)



Wed, 30 Jul 2003 03:20:03 GMT  
 Opinions on TERSE please?


Quote:

> On kind of an off-note; when I first came across IDA I wanted to use it,
but the
> version they had as freeware at the time didn't produce output files.  So
then I
> started cracking it... that one was tough.  But once I realized I was
going to
> be actually using it more than once I took some money and paid for the
current
> version; not so much because I needed more than I had with the cracked
version
> but because I know from experience that good software takes work, and the
author
> was trying to make a living at it.  Bottom line is I generally pay for
software
> nowadays because it just makes sense to share what you have with people if
they
> are helping to make your life work better.  (although I may not be willing
to
> pay as much for poor-quality software such as win*).

Agreed. But there are some problems... For instance, if I do some stuff
which is not a part of my work and I don't get anything for it or even
worse -- I don't have a job at all and/or my wage hardly compares with the
cost of the software I want (just think of a few hundreds of $ a month in
Russia (often less than that -- around $50-$100/month, if the town/city is
far away from Moscow or St-Peterburg) -- how much would you buy?) then it's
hard to get the software this way. And this is why there are still piracy,
warez, hackers, crackers, whatever.

What I don't get is the fact that software is very often sold at same cost
to all countries and this makes difference. What I also don't get is the
fact that there's very often no way to get software for free if a programmer
is not gonna make commercial stuff with it but instead want to use it for
educational purpose, to gain some practice and stuff like that.
You may say, if company politics changes and the company starts selling
software at different cost to different countries or just give it away for
free to those who requested it for educational/non-commercial purposes then
it's possible that there would be some bad guys who would brake rules and
use that free software for commercial purposes or even buy same software
cheaper in other countries and thus pay nearly nothing due to geographical
cost difference...
But hell, there must be some way.
For instance, it's hard to make real money with something like Turbo Pascal
or Turbo C 3.x. These compilers are pretty much outdated. But still Borland
does not give them away. Nearly same situation with their TASM because
Borland is not gonna continue this product and there's MASM available from
win SDK (or whatever that thing is) for free. But I think they wouldn't lose
money if they gave it away. Etc, etc.

Good Luck
--
Alexei A. Frounze
alexfru [AT] chat [DOT] ru
http://alexfru.chat.ru
http://members.xoom.com/alexfru/
http://welcome.to/pmode/



Wed, 30 Jul 2003 05:54:35 GMT  
 Opinions on TERSE please?

Quote:

> At  about 200,000 lines of code, I don't think anyone will
> be cloning the HLA system anytime soon :-).  Of course, it also
> helps that HLA is free so the fact that I'm not making any money
> off this staves off that offense (though I could never understand
> why someone would have a problem with an individual making
> money off that individual's own work).
> Randy Hyde

I would pay to use software including HLA if I had any use for it.

As I understand it HLA uses the MS windows. What advantage is that
over VC++ and maybe inline assembler if needed? At the moment I am
using DJGPP and NASM with MSDOS and will probably change to Linux.

I think in terms of goal orientated programming or GOP for short :-)

What is the goal and what do you need to achieve it. When I learnt
assembler it was the only means I had to write fast software.

In my experience the hard part is not the programming language or
obtaining programming tools but rather access to the knowledge
required to use the language to achieve the goal.

--
John Casey



Wed, 30 Jul 2003 08:47:28 GMT  
 Opinions on TERSE please?



Quote:
>  From what Randy says, that doesn't sound like fair play to me at all...

> For instance, if I charge for the "BethTool" (we'll assume that everyone
> likes the tool and finds it useful and it does all the things I've hyped it
> to do ;), then would someone here try to undercut me with a free "clone"?

I doubt it -- people are likely to provide a cheaper (or free) clone
of something primarily if they consider the price unreasonable.  
Given what you've hyped your tool to do, the price would have to be
_extremely_ high before it became unreasonable.

[ ... ]

Quote:
> If someone were to make a free clone of anything I've made then, basically,
> this has the potential to ruin lives...whether you thought of that or
> not...sounds melodramatic?

Yes, somewhat.  It seems doubtful to me that even if nobody cloned
anything, that having an expectation of building your entire life
around the revenues from a tool for assembly language is unrealistic,
to put it nicely.

Quote:
> Basically, just because in your life you may be sitting pretty and, from
> your perspective, that charging for basic tools is something you'd rather
> not do - you'd rather spend the money on a good night out or something -
> does not imply that everyone has such liberties also...

In the end, it's all a matter of price.  You've got to price things
cheaply enough that it's easier for somebody to buy your product than
to duplicate it.  If you're selling to computer illiterates, that
threshold is pretty high because they're going to have difficulty
duplicating much of anything.  If your market is assembly language
programmers, the threshold is a lot lower -- you're looking mostly at
people with substantial skill, and in at least some cases, quite a
bit of time on their hands as well.  As such, anything you sell had
better be really cheap, or else so large and complex enough that it's
really difficult to duplicate.

Quote:
> It's also a bit short-sighted...if people had paid for TERSE then maybe this
> would have given Jim Neil the resources and the time to be able to devote
> towards a much better product...maybe "TERSE 2" would have been the miracle
> we're all looking for from our tools...maybe, for the sake of a few pints
> down the pub, you've just cut your own throat...

Maybe so, but probably not.  The reality is that the TERSE clones
were written by a couple of people in their spare time in a matter of
a couple of days.  The simple fact is that he was charging quite a
high price for what was (or at least should have been) a fairly
trivial piece of work.  When you charge enough that it's easier for
somebody to duplicate your work than buy it, you've pretty much got
to expect that they'll do exactly that.

Quote:
> If my intended future direction goes the way I'm planning and hoping for,
> then it's going to be difficult enough to get by for the initial period
> without having someone maliciously ruin the products I'm developing...so, if
> anyone would intend to do this, let me know so that I can just trash my
> dream of a better life into the trashcan and go back to grovelling to the
> boss...

I doubt anybody has any particular intent of trashing anybody's life.  
In most cases, the question is far more whether they consider the
price you want reasonable for what you provide.

In the end, I think there's a fairly simple rule: most people won't
spend more than a few weeks working on something just for fun.  If
you want to create a marketable product, you've GOT to ensure that it
will take nearly anybody else at least somewhat longer than that to
re-create.  Once you do so, there are really two possibilities left:
either you've created something so wonderful that people are willing
to go to extraordinary lengths working on something similar (e.g.
Linus working on a UNIX clone) or else you've got a big enough market
that somebody's going to try to duplicate it because they think the
market size justifies the effort.

If either of these happens, you've got a few choices as well.  First
and most obvious, you can simply compete -- you're already ahead, so
unless they've got a LOT more resources than you do, you can probably
stay ahead.  Second, you can throw in the towel.  If somebody the
size of Microsoft moves into your market, chances are this is fairly
sensible.  Third, you can use patents, copyrights, trademarks, etc.
to protect what you've done.  If what you've done is really original,
novel, etc. chances are you can do this quite successfully.  Some
companies have been innovative enough that they make this work
_quite_ well -- for example, for at least a while (and possibly still
for all I know) Texas Instruments was actually making MORE money off
of their patents on IC fabrication than they were off of building and
selling ICs themselves.

--
    Later,
    Jerry.

The Universe is a figment of its own imagination



Wed, 30 Jul 2003 12:28:58 GMT  
 Opinions on TERSE please?



wrote at Fri, 9 Feb 2001 21:54:35 :-

Quote:
>For instance, it's hard to make real money with something like Turbo Pascal
>or Turbo C 3.x. These compilers are pretty much outdated. But still Borland
>does not give them away.

Borland do give away TP1, TP3.02, TP5.5 (& TC2.01); in the museum
section of their Web site.  I don't know TP5.5, but I've used TP5
extensively and, for work that can be done on a small DOS machine, it is
good.  Unfortunately, they neither give away nor sell TP7/BP7, their
final pre-Delphi Pascal products - though there is a clear demand still,
for the amateur/educational market.

--

 Web <URL: http://www.merlyn.demon.co.uk/> - FAQish topics, acronyms, & links.
 Proper 4-line sig. separator is as above, a line exactly "-- " (SonOfRFC1036)
 Do not Mail News to me. Before a reply, quote with ">" or "> " (SonOfRFC1036)



Thu, 31 Jul 2003 01:15:25 GMT  
 Opinions on TERSE please?

[snip]

Quote:

> > If someone were to make a free clone of anything I've made then,
basically,
> > this has the potential to ruin lives...whether you thought of that or
> > not...sounds melodramatic?

> Yes, somewhat.  It seems doubtful to me that even if nobody cloned
> anything, that having an expectation of building your entire life
> around the revenues from a tool for assembly language is unrealistic,
> to put it nicely.

Oh...I agree...didn't mean to imply this was what I was staking everything
on...note I said "anything I made", not specifically this one thing...the
"BethTool" is just the example to quote because it's been mentioned here
before and is what I'm currently developing...it's the underlying principle
I was trying to address...

But, yes, that would be a stupid business move indeed...I usually work on
some sort of safety net before I venture into anything new...maybe overly
careful but it stops things blowing up in your face...

I'm idealistic but realistic, I think...but I guess others would
disagree...lol ;)

Thanks for your views...I see the points you're making and they're certainly
food for thought...

Beth :)



Thu, 31 Jul 2003 01:15:32 GMT  
 Opinions on TERSE please?

Quote:

> A lot of people think software is easy to write... but writing it is not
the
> hard part.  Even huge programs come together with planning, it just takes

time.

Quote:
> But the hard part is supporting it after you've written it...  I've spent
a
> *lot* of time supporting all the stuff I've got on my site and it really
takes
> an effort talking to people, trying to reproduce bugs, trying to show
people how
> to use what you've got.  Trying to keep the documentation updated so you
can
> stave off further communications issues as well.  Over the last few months
I've
> just gotten so many features request, bug fix requests, and so forth and I
just
> don't want to keep up with them any more now that I have a full-time job.
But
> people who ARE doing that kind of legwork often need money and support.

This is the sort of thing that has me interested rather than just being a
wage slave to someone else...I would welcome that sort of
thing...really...I'm not afraid of hard work...that's not an issue...

And, yes, this is the point I was making...to be able to do that kind of
work, I would require some sort of basic financing to allow me the freedom
to do it...hence, why the prospect of having my products/services undermined
would present me with a problem...that was what I was getting at...

Quote:
> On kind of an off-note; when I first came across IDA I wanted to use it,
but the
> version they had as freeware at the time didn't produce output files.  So
then I
> started cracking it... that one was tough.  But once I realized I was
going to
> be actually using it more than once I took some money and paid for the
current
> version; not so much because I needed more than I had with the cracked
version
> but because I know from experience that good software takes work, and the
author
> was trying to make a living at it. Bottom line is I generally pay for
software
> nowadays because it just makes sense to share what you have with people if
they
> are helping to make your life work better.  (although I may not be willing
to
> pay as much for poor-quality software such as win*).

Again, this is what I was getting at and you're philosophy now seems
right...but there are many out there who would not have such a "revelation"
and would attack my products and services and, therefore, be actually
attacking me...

Beth :)



Thu, 31 Jul 2003 01:15:45 GMT  
 
 [ 25 post ]  Go to page: [1] [2]

 Relevant Pages 

1. Please help--I need the opinions of experienced Object-Oriented Developers

2. Opinion please on 5i

3. 800x600 or 640x480 - Opinions Please

4. PLEASE ! Need your opinion about my program

5. Your opinion please

6. Please help--I need the opinions of experienced Object-Oriented Developers

7. Coding Standards: Opinions please

8. opinion please : newsgroup or mailing list

9. An opinion please...

10. opinions please

11. Opinions Please. {:o)

12. RDoc and XML - opinions please

 

 
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software