Waveform Display Systems 
Author Message
 Waveform Display Systems

Does anyone have any recommendations on a waveform display system for Verilog?

Regards, Steve Pollock



Mon, 23 Sep 1996 02:10:03 GMT  
 Waveform Display Systems

Quote:

>Does anyone have any recommendations on a waveform display system for Verilog?
>Regards, Steve Pollock

Hi!
There are several tools out there. Some examples...

VirSim from Simulation Technologies
Undertow from Veritools
Signalscan from Design Acceleration
Cwave from Cadence (Not sure if this can be used as a stand alone tool)
Epilog and NextView from Nextwave Design Automation
Magellan from Systems Science

That's a start :)

           ______                      _  __            
          /_  __/__  __ _  ___ ____   / |/ /__  ___  ___
           / / / _ \/  ' \/ _ `(_-<  /    / _ \/ _ \/ _ \
          /_/  \___/_/_/_/\_,_/___/ /_/|_/\___/ .__/ .__/
                                             /_/  /_/    
********************************************************************
* Tomas Nopp                    Tel   : +46 8 727 33 24            *
* Ellemtel Telecom Systems Labs Fax   : +46 8 647 80 59            *

* S-125 25 ALVSJO       <------ Snailmail                          *
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Mon, 23 Sep 1996 14:09:40 GMT  
 Waveform Display Systems

Quote:
Nopp) writes:

Any preferences for any of these systems?  Do you feel that any one has
significantly better characteristics than the others?


Mon, 23 Sep 1996 15:30:03 GMT  
 Waveform Display Systems

Quote:


>Nopp) writes:
>Any preferences for any of these systems?  Do you feel that any one has
>significantly better characteristics than the others?

Well.....
I am currently using Undertow and it works fine. However there are ALWAYS
gonna be another tool that some designer will prefer cuz it can do this and
that and the current one can't.........
But from what I could see at the IVC there are a few worth to pay a bit more
attention (IMHO!!)to.
They're all very similar but Signalscan and Epilog/NextView don't have the
source debugging facility.
VirSim  can't do conectivity tracing.
The most complete ones are Magellan and Undertow followed by Epilog/NextView,
VirSim and Signalscan.
I'm sorry, but it's very difficult to give you a straight answer to which one
that is to prefer. If you have the time and effort, get some evaluation copies
to try out.

           ______                      _  __            
          /_  __/__  __ _  ___ ____   / |/ /__  ___  ___
           / / / _ \/  ' \/ _ `(_-<  /    / _ \/ _ \/ _ \
          /_/  \___/_/_/_/\_,_/___/ /_/|_/\___/ .__/ .__/
                                             /_/  /_/    
********************************************************************
* Tomas Nopp                    Tel   : +46 8 727 33 24            *
* Ellemtel Telecom Systems Labs Fax   : +46 8 647 80 59            *

* S-125 25 ALVSJO       <------ Snailmail                          *
********************************************************************



Mon, 23 Sep 1996 20:04:10 GMT  
 Waveform Display Systems
I concur with Tomas' response.  We are currently using Undertow after some
lengthy evaluation last year.  Veritools' is constantly adding feature just
like everyone else.  Today's top vendor will be leapfrogged by the other guy
next month, but will come back in the following months.  Evaluate them, and
then figure out who will still be there and is most cost effective.

Quote:



>>Nopp) writes:

>>Any preferences for any of these systems?  Do you feel that any one has
>>significantly better characteristics than the others?

>Well.....
>I am currently using Undertow and it works fine. However there are ALWAYS
>gonna be another tool that some designer will prefer cuz it can do this and
>that and the current one can't.........
>But from what I could see at the IVC there are a few worth to pay a bit more
>attention (IMHO!!)to.
>They're all very similar but Signalscan and Epilog/NextView don't have the
>source debugging facility.
>VirSim  can't do conectivity tracing.
>The most complete ones are Magellan and Undertow followed by Epilog/NextView,
>VirSim and Signalscan.
>I'm sorry, but it's very difficult to give you a straight answer to which one
>that is to prefer. If you have the time and effort, get some evaluation copies
>to try out.

>           ______                      _  __            
>          /_  __/__  __ _  ___ ____   / |/ /__  ___  ___
>           / / / _ \/  ' \/ _ `(_-<  /    / _ \/ _ \/ _ \
>          /_/  \___/_/_/_/\_,_/___/ /_/|_/\___/ .__/ .__/
>                                             /_/  /_/    
>********************************************************************
>* Tomas Nopp                    Tel   : +46 8 727 33 24            *
>* Ellemtel Telecom Systems Labs Fax   : +46 8 647 80 59            *

>* S-125 25 ALVSJO       <------ Snailmail                          *
>********************************************************************

--


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Tue, 24 Sep 1996 01:15:03 GMT  
 Waveform Display Systems

Quote:

> Does anyone have any recommendations on a waveform display system for Verilog?

> Regards, Steve Pollock

I'm interested in knowing what people think of "Undertow" from
Veritools, and "Versim" from Simulation Technologies.

Comments?

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Wed, 25 Sep 1996 05:39:58 GMT  
 Waveform Display Systems

    [... stuff deleted ...]

   Hi!
   There are several tools out there. Some examples...

   VirSim from Simulation Technologies
   Undertow from Veritools
   Signalscan from Design Acceleration
   Cwave from Cadence (Not sure if this can be used as a stand alone tool)

cWaves does work in a standalone mode, as well as with the integrated
Verilog/Composer environment. For standalone users, there is a separate
executable for standalone users which is a slimmed down executable containing
just the cWaves functionality.

cWaves also works with Leapfrog, the VHDL simulator from Cadence, and is able
to display the entire set of VHDL data types, including User defined types.
This last bit of information is provided as trivia, since I would imagine
that not many readers of this group would really care if it could handle
VHDL data or not :-)

   Epilog and NextView from Nextwave Design Automation
   Magellan from Systems Science

   That's a start :)

              ______                      _  __            
             /_  __/__  __ _  ___ ____   / |/ /__  ___  ___
              / / / _ \/  ' \/ _ `(_-<  /    / _ \/ _ \/ _ \
             /_/  \___/_/_/_/\_,_/___/ /_/|_/\___/ .__/ .__/
                                                /_/  /_/    
   ********************************************************************
   * Tomas Nopp                    Tel   : +46 8 727 33 24            *
   * Ellemtel Telecom Systems Labs Fax   : +46 8 647 80 59            *

   * S-125 25 ALVSJO       <------ Snailmail                          *
   ********************************************************************
--

Cadence Design Systems           v-mail: (508) 446-6269
270 Billerica Road                 It's easier to change the specifications to
Chelmsford, Mass. 01824-4140       fit the program than vice-versa.



Sat, 28 Sep 1996 00:09:41 GMT  
 Waveform Display Systems

Quote:
>>   Cwave from Cadence (Not sure if this can be used as a stand alone tool)
>cWaves does work in a standalone mode, as well as with the integrated
>Verilog/Composer environment. For standalone users, there is a separate
>executable for standalone users which is a slimmed down executable containing
>just the cWaves functionality.
>cWaves also works with Leapfrog, the VHDL simulator from Cadence, and is able
>to display the entire set of VHDL data types, including User defined types.
>This last bit of information is provided as trivia, since I would imagine
>that not many readers of this group would really care if it could handle
>VHDL data or not :-)

Thanks for your remark(!) Mark ;) Actually I did find this out yesterday when
I tried running cWaves standalone.

           ______                      _  __            
          /_  __/__  __ _  ___ ____   / |/ /__  ___  ___
           / / / _ \/  ' \/ _ `(_-<  /    / _ \/ _ \/ _ \
          /_/  \___/_/_/_/\_,_/___/ /_/|_/\___/ .__/ .__/
                                             /_/  /_/    
********************************************************************
* Tomas Nopp                    Tel   : +46 8 727 33 24            *
* Ellemtel Telecom Systems Labs Fax   : +46 8 647 80 59            *

* S-125 25 ALVSJO       <------ Snailmail                          *
********************************************************************



Sat, 28 Sep 1996 14:10:59 GMT  
 Waveform Display Systems

Quote:

> Any preferences for any of these systems?  Do you feel that any one has
> significantly better characteristics than the others?

Well - no preferences - but I'm continually appalled by the user
interfaces - red and green on black just don't hack it - hurts
the eyes (and doesn't take into account the percentage of the
population that's red-green colorblind) - how about making the colors,
background and display formats user programable so I can choose my
prefered display (black on a light blue background embedded in a
white frame with a stippled red/black pattern for Xs and a white
patterned value for buses [except when the buses are all 0s or
1s when they look like wires]).

So I have wierd tastes - (well I don't think so) - but I've had
the luxury of creating my own waveform display and being able
to choose what I think is usefull. If I were making it a
selling product I'd do what I'd do for the other
applications I've sold - hire a professional to design the
user interface - as a rule programmers shouldn't design user
interfaces (me included) - get an artist.

Over the past few weeks I've evaluated lots of waveform displays
and I've been appaled - those that do have programmable colors
have it done through some script hidden away somewhere and limit
you to a small number of predefined colors - let me pop up
a color chooser interactively and play with the interface untill
I'm happy with it. The worst one I saw didn't seem to be
programmable and was the dreaded red/green on black in a
gross electric blue frame (you know who you are).

My other hot button is combined simulation/waveform systems
where the waveform display window doesn't have a stop/go button
on it (yes I know it's often a different program but there's
no reason why they can't talk) - again get a user interface
professional - the controls for the waveform display should
be on it - and even though to the developer the display and
simulation environments may be seperate programs/functions etc
to the user the simulation stop/go button directly effects the
waveform.

    Paul

______________________________________________________________________

"Xenon? It's a rare gas ...."



Tue, 01 Oct 1996 02:33:35 GMT  
 
 [ 9 post ] 

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