LOGO-L> Intensive Logo in Australia 
Author Message
 LOGO-L> Intensive Logo in Australia

Hi Bill

We use MicroWorlds intensively at Caulfield North Primary School. As it is
a government school it is also a co ed school.
I "teach" Microworlds to the whole school from prep to grade 6 (5 to 12
year olds)
Every grade has one hour a week with myself then a further hour in the
computer room with the classroom teacher. Other times are also available
during the week for extra classes and individuals.

We have also just recently purchased the LEGO dacta control lab kits and
software.  I am targeting the grades 4 to 6 with this equipment.

Cheers Richard

You said.....

 >I want a list of schools in Australia that use Logo / MicroWorlds intensively

Quote:
>(for a paper I'm writing). Here is my list so far:-

>Methodist Ladies College, Melbourne
>John Paul College (Brisbane)
>The Glennie School, Toowoomba
>Woodlands Anglican Girls School, Adelaide
>Batlow Technology K-12 School, NSW

>If your school qualifies for the list I'd be pleased to hear. By intensive I
>think I mean that its an established part of the school policy, supported by
>the Admin. by inservice time etc. (as distinct from individual enthusiasts
>like
>my self who use MW/Logo intensively in my own classes but have not been
>able to
>persuade the school as a whole to adopt it as a policy).

>Bill Kerr
>Paralowie R12 School
>South Australia
>---------------------------------------------------------------




=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v

                        Richard Impey
                        Information Technology Specialist
                        Phone 0011 61 3 9509 6872
                        Caulfield North Primary School
                        186 Balaclava Road
                        Caulfield North 3161
                        Melbourne, Victoria, Australia

=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v
=v

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Sat, 06 May 2000 03:00:00 GMT  
 LOGO-L> Intensive Logo in Australia

Re Caulfield North PS being an Intensive Logo user.

More info for your statistics....just to spice up the discussion ;-)

We are also from Melbourne.
We are a relatively poor school as we are Government funded
We are a smallish school with only about 190 - 200 students enroled
We have a very high migrant population - with not much capacity for fund raising
Co educational
No laptops

Everyone knows that innovation in teaching in Australia has traditionally
come from the Government schools and only when it is safe to do so do the
private schools follow.
We only hear about the private schools "success and innovation" because
they have the finacial capacity and need to self promote.

I wonder how many of those private schools with their expensive adds
showing children engrossed in their laptops actually have a truely
integrated (through out the curriculum) laptop/computer program.

No flames please :-)

Cheers Richard

  So it looks like the place to target MicroWorlds growth is as follows:-

Quote:
>> * Private Schools (10 out of 11 on list, massive disproportion)
>> * Girls Schools ( 6 out of 11, a massive disporportion)
>> * Years 3-9 (Primary, Middle School)
>> -- Bill Kerr
>Bill
>you might've added: * Be in Melbourne(6/11)....
>Tho' as you say, your sample is small, it is possible to theorise.
>Australian teachers have a strong tradition of autonomy. Imposing
>cuuriculum, syllabus, techniques, whatever, has always been problematic,
>and I see this as a great strength in Australian schooling.

>Private schools have a much easier brief to impose a mandated approach.
>But this isn't even half the reason. The schools you listed can also be
>distinguished as 'laptop' schools, where every child has their own
>portable computer. A program like this is more likely in private schools
>also.
>A key factor is that 'school zero' in the laptop idea, MLC
>Melbourne, began the laptop scheme with logo/constructionism as its
>rationale, so as it was emulated, logo came with the package. MLC is also
>an all girls' school, so it has tended to influence like institutions.

>I think it's your final factor, primary/middle school that is the the
>most generalisable. The kind of work styles and arrangements of a primary
>classroom; integrated curriculum, homeroom, relative freedom from external
>timetable intrusions, etc., provide the most favourable school-based context
>for project based, expressive and exploratory work that is germane to the
>logo spirit.

>Jeff Richardson
>---------------------------------------------------------------




=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v

                        Richard Impey
                        Information Technology Specialist
                        Phone 0011 61 3 9509 6872
                        Caulfield North Primary School
                        186 Balaclava Road
                        Caulfield North 3161
                        Melbourne, Victoria, Australia

=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v
=v

---------------------------------------------------------------





Sat, 06 May 2000 03:00:00 GMT  
 LOGO-L> Intensive Logo in Australia

Richard,
I know you are a nice guy and are doing good things at your school.
But one you are well appointed technically and have more support than
most schools!
2ndly don't lump or stereotype schools or systems, very dangerous.
Innovation happens in all systems, there is nothing safe about being
in any school system in this day and age.
Teachers reflect the impetus of innovative changes (not systems)
I see many good things, collaborative learning being one of them as
well as an integrated curriculum happening at a number of Private
schools. MLC has been the leader in promoting MICROWORLDS and LOGO in
general for the last 9 years. We even have funded a conference in 93
for LOGO (which wasn't a money spinner).
We have shared with schools and teachers from all systems, so be kind
when making sweeping statements about schools, laptops and
innovations!

Steve Costa
Steve Costa
MLC

---------------------------------------------------------------





Sat, 06 May 2000 03:00:00 GMT  
 LOGO-L> Intensive Logo in Australia

Hi Steve

Thanks for the compliment and you are quite right that I should not lump
all schools into one stereo type. MLC has been a pioneer in Melbourne if
not Australia and beyond in changing the work practices in school and
approaches to education in particular with it's laptop program.
MLC has achieved a level of expertise and practice to which I aspire and
hopefully my own school community will one day soon be joining.

Also the innovation in education I was actually refering to was not ment to
be restricted to the use of computers in education but across the whole of
the curriculum and over the 100 or so years of education in Australia.
Please correct me if I'm wrong but over the years haven't private schools
been seen and acted as bastions of a traditional education? My impression
is that certain government schools in similar socio economic areas to the
wealthier private schools also similarly presented themselves. Where as out
in the lower socio economic suburbs, where the new graduates were sent,
innovation thrived.

But may I rephrase my statement.....
False advertising by "some" private schools gets up my nose!

Similarly so do the Luddite schools of which there are many in our
Government system!
I weep when I see expensive computers in classrooms at other schools with
children using/playing programs that have little educational value other
than improving the students fine motor skills when using a mouse.
After 15 years of computers being in schools how much advancement has
really been made in their integration across the curriculum both in primary
and secondary schools?

On the question of support for our school.

It has been far from easy. Basically we have been able to finance our
Learning Technologies (IT) through drastic budget cuts to other areas of
the curriculum along with {*filter*}, sweat and tears. If it wasn't for our
previous pricipal Pauline Cripps, we would never be in the position we are
now. Our current principal Jennie Douglas has been even more determined in
promoting the use of learning technologies in our school.
Principal support is paramount.
Pauline, was very proud to have to be able to final afford to purchase the
intial 10 multimedia computers about 2.5 years ago after having scrimped
and saved judiciously over a number of years.
Compared to many other government schools, particularly in our area, (Glen
Eira and Bayside) our fund raising ability is very meagre.
I find it very frustrating when I see some of the other schools
(Government), with the "buckets" of money they are able to raise compared
to our school, not putting anything much into IT purchases or professional
development.

Government Support.....

Unfortunately we were only able to take a small advantage of the
Government's 1996/7 grant of $1 for every $3 raised locally when we
purchased three more computers and a color printer.
This meant only about $2500? worth of grants (....peanuts).

Earlier this year we applied and received a Government grant of $10,000 for
best practice with Learning Technologies (IT). We put this money towards
purchasing software and equipment to further promote in our school,
multimedia production, our Cable TV studio and robotics. The 5 robotics
kits alone cost us $5000 and our dedicated internet phone line cost $700
dollars to install. For this money we are expected to run low cost (cover
expenses) professional development for (Government????) schools at $25 for
a full day course in MicroWorlds or ClarisWorks (Graphics) along with
school tours at $15 for a half day. There was also a Government grant given
to all government schools of about $500???? for connecting to the internet.
So our outside financial support has been up to about $14,000
Don't get me wrong I have appreciated the government grants but over 2.5
years it really isn't that much is it? Also I love to be able to have the
chance to inspire others in using Learning Technologies in schools. (Last
term we had over a hundred teachers come through our school) and being a
member of the Leading Practice Classroom Network has enabled me to do just
that.

A lot of the changing practice we see in both school systems is being
driven by the need to attract (or maintain) a greater market share of the
available and potential student population. Hence the comment about "false"
advertising.

One thing that Government schools have been very poor at is self promotion.
Until recently there probably hasn't been a need.
When one considers the current government economic rationalisation and
school closures you are quite right there is nothing safe about being in
any school system in this day and age.

Even our local Universities (Melbourne and Monash) are considering joint
activities in attracting overseas students and other projects!!! (See
todays Age newspaper)

You should come over and visit sometime (I wont charge you....promise!)

Cheers Richard

You said.....

Quote:
>I know you are a nice guy and are doing good things at your school.
>But one you are well appointed technically and have more support than
>most schools!
>2ndly don't lump or stereotype schools or systems, very dangerous.
>Innovation happens in all systems, there is nothing safe about being
>in any school system in this day and age.
>Teachers reflect the impetus of innovative changes (not systems)
>I see many good things, collaborative learning being one of them as
>well as an integrated curriculum happening at a number of Private
>schools. MLC has been the leader in promoting MICROWORLDS and LOGO in
>general for the last 9 years. We even have funded a conference in 93
>for LOGO (which wasn't a money spinner).
>We have shared with schools and teachers from all systems, so be kind
>when making sweeping statements about schools, laptops and
>innovations!

>Steve Costa
>Steve Costa
>MLC


=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v

                        Richard Impey
                        Information Technology Specialist
                        Phone 0011 61 3 9509 6872
                        Caulfield North Primary School
                        186 Balaclava Road
                        Caulfield North 3161
                        Melbourne, Victoria, Australia

=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v=v
=v

---------------------------------------------------------------





Sun, 07 May 2000 03:00:00 GMT  
 LOGO-L> Intensive Logo in Australia

Quote:
>Its interesting that the Coombabah government school experiment in intensive
>began at the same time as MLC. After a 4 year trial (at Coombabah) which
>by all
>accounts was successful this innovation was not continued. Good logo
>teachers
>then migrated over to the Private system.

Hi Bill,

I actually worked at Coombabah before I worked at MLC and naively
believed that THEY would succeed and not MLC. At the time, the Queensland
Govt. was promising a laptop for every kid in the state within a couple
of years. Within that period they abandoned support for just 60 kids. ALL
schools and administrators have a problem with attention-span.

I had a ball working at Coombabah and am rather fond of the professionals
involved.

Parenthetically, the Queensland Ministry of Education has owed me $100
since 1990 when they made me share a motel room with two others AND pay!
This should have been a harbinger for the laptop program.

-=Gary
---------------------------------------------------------------





Mon, 08 May 2000 03:00:00 GMT  
 LOGO-L> Intensive Logo in Australia


Quote:
>Everyone knows that innovation in teaching in Australia has traditionally
>come from the Government schools and only when it is safe to do so do the
>private schools follow.
>We only hear about the private schools "success and innovation" because
>they have the finacial capacity and need to self promote.

Its interesting that the Coombabah government school experiment in intensive
began at the same time as MLC. After a 4 year trial (at Coombabah) which by all
accounts was successful this innovation was not continued. Good logo teachers
then migrated over to the Private system.

This is a good example of how hopeless government bureaucracy is. If there are
enough chairs in the room and the person out the front breathes then government
is satisfied.

Quote:
> No flames please :-)

 spoil sport.

-- Bill Kerr
---------------------------------------------------------------





Mon, 08 May 2000 03:00:00 GMT  
 LOGO-L> Intensive Logo in Australia

Quote:
> Part of Seymour's philosophy was to take the tools of the wealthy and
>sophisticated and give them to the poor -- well, it aint happening!

So, what are we going to do about this? The fourth issue of the Logo
Exchange (June '98) is being tentatively planned as "Looking for Logo in
All the Wrong Places." I hope to spotlight the places where Logo is
succeeding against the socioeconomic/political odds. Perhaps someone from
Batlow can write something.

I reckon that one of the biggest obstacles to widespread Logo use in
Australian State Schools is the incredible level of centralization
involved. There is however a great deal of interest  in MicroWorlds,
particularly in Victorian state schools.

While we attempt to solve this huge problem, check out Geraldine
Kozberg's inspirational discussion of the topic at:

http://lcs.www.media.mit.edu/groups/logo-foundation/Publications/Gerr...

-=Stager
---------------------------------------------------------------





Thu, 11 May 2000 03:00:00 GMT  
 LOGO-L> Intensive Logo in Australia

Quote:

>I actually worked at Coombabah before I worked at MLC and naively
>believed that THEY would succeed and not MLC. At the time, the Queensland
>Govt. was promising a laptop for every kid in the state within a couple
>of years. Within that period they abandoned support for just 60 kids. ALL
>schools and administrators have a problem with attention-span.

 One of the few government schools in Australia today that is running an
intensive Logo program is Batlow Technology School in the NSW countryside.
Apparently this is being run as a magnet school model.

 The administrators I know here in South Australia are very suspicious of the
magnet school model because they see it as a generator of inequality. If we
can't offer something to everybody then we shouldn't offer it to anybody.
Competition and difference in the government sector is viewed with suspicion.
Private schools aren't weighed down by these considerations.

 My wish would be for government schools to encourage more diversity without
abandoning the social justice principle. ie. equal but different.

 It seems clear from my growing list of Private schools doing intensive logo
(cf. very few government schools) that risk taking and innovation is more a
virtue in Private schools now than government schools -- whatever the situation
has been in the past.

 Part of Seymour's philosophy was to take the tools of the wealthy and
sophisticated and give them to the poor -- well, it aint happening!

-- Bill Kerr

---------------------------------------------------------------





Thu, 11 May 2000 03:00:00 GMT  
 LOGO-L> Intensive Logo in Australia


Quote:

>> Part of Seymour's philosophy was to take the tools of the wealthy and
>>sophisticated and give them to the poor -- well, it aint happening!

[snip]
Quote:
> check out Geraldine
>Kozberg's inspirational discussion of the topic at:

> http://www.*-*-*.com/

That link is stale.  The correct one is

http://www.*-*-*.com/ #revolution

Also, a new organization called the 2B1 Foundation was recently formed to
address issues of equity of access to technolgy, and the explore ways in
which {*filter*}space may help bridge economic, gender, age, and geographic
barriers.  We had an inital meeting last July, which included
represetnatives from 60 countries.  Seymour Papert is one of the leaders of
this organization.  Visit the web site at

http://www.*-*-*.com/

-Michael

--------------------------------------------------------
Michael Tempel                    tel: 212 579 8028
Logo Foundation                   fax: 212 579 8013

New York  NY 10024
http://www.*-*-*.com/

---------------------------------------------------------------





Thu, 11 May 2000 03:00:00 GMT  
 
 [ 9 post ] 

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