Why everything got to be free? 
Author Message
 Why everything got to be free?

Fellows,

I read in so many messages that one need a piece of software for some
purpose, and at the end, the great majority of them has a line stating that
it would be nice if it were free, etc...

I suggest these "wanna everything free" guys to consider the fact that,
having to pay for software can be turned into a push in what regards to
making money.

Last year I gave a speech at Brasil's Devcon where I approached the subject
of being professionals instead of amateurs. And the reason I'm posting this
message here is because I think that many commercial problems we all face
when we say our service will use Clarion as one of its resources, is
directly related to the fact that many of us are presented to customers as
ones that would produce solutions using not aways available software, as a
free one may be.

This is something to think.

Regards to all



Mon, 09 Feb 2004 23:35:02 GMT  
 Why everything got to be free?

Quote:

> I read in so many messages that one need a piece of software for some
> purpose, and at the end, the great majority of them has a line stating that
> it would be nice if it were free, etc...

My guess is that its often because non-free means "I have to spend hours
convincing mgmt to spend this money and filing the appropriate paperwork".

But thats just my guess. I have no problem spending $ to save time, as long
as I *have* the money to spend:)

---
Mark Riffey
Granite Bear Development
http://www.granitebear.com

Software for professional photography
studios, cultured marble / cast polymer /
solid surface manufacturers and non-profit
organizations



Mon, 09 Feb 2004 18:43:18 GMT  
 Why everything got to be free?
Gustavo:
I think sometimes the problem seems so simple that the person thinks the
solution will be so. In addition to that we have been spoiled with such
great freebies as the Tintools, Vince Sorensen's ABC Free templates , etc.
Not all Clarion users and developers are in the big ticket price category,
and some are just 'testing the waters' before they jump in.

My $0.02

Ygnacio Moreno.

Quote:

>Fellows,

>I read in so many messages that one need a piece of software for some
>purpose, and at the end, the great majority of them has a line stating that
>it would be nice if it were free, etc...

>I suggest these "wanna everything free" guys to consider the fact that,
>having to pay for software can be turned into a push in what regards to
>making money.

>Last year I gave a speech at Brasil's Devcon where I approached the subject
>of being professionals instead of amateurs. And the reason I'm posting this
>message here is because I think that many commercial problems we all face
>when we say our service will use Clarion as one of its resources, is
>directly related to the fact that many of us are presented to customers as
>ones that would produce solutions using not aways available software, as a
>free one may be.

>This is something to think.

>Regards to all



Tue, 10 Feb 2004 03:18:41 GMT  
 Why everything got to be free?
Hi Gustavo

I for one can see both sides, both as a user and as a supplier.  The reason
that I have a free template set is simply that the utilities are things that
I have knocked up for my own use in the past, and they are not really want I
would consider of a commercial standard.  They do the job, but it would not
be worth supporting them for the very small amount that they would be worth.
On the other hand, if a free template is popular and it can be improved to a
more professional standard then I would be more than happy to take it to a
higher level, add functionality, documentation and support to it.  The only
one that so far falls into this category is the resort template which
probably will re-appear in a 'paid for' version with a lot more added.

I will however continue to add to my free templates as I write stuff which
may be of general interest.

Cheers
Simon Burrows
VariView templates. - Display your variables and fields as you run your
application
WordSpell templates. - Seamlessly use MS Word's Spell checker in your apps.
Screen Redesigner templates - Let your customers change your screen layouts
and control properties to suit their needs at runtime.
List & Label Templates - Unlimited report layouts, defined by your user at
runtime in your Clarion application
Free template sets
http://www.solace-software.demon.co.uk


Quote:
> Fellows,

> I read in so many messages that one need a piece of software for some
> purpose, and at the end, the great majority of them has a line stating
that
> it would be nice if it were free, etc...

> I suggest these "wanna everything free" guys to consider the fact that,
> having to pay for software can be turned into a push in what regards to
> making money.

> Last year I gave a speech at Brasil's Devcon where I approached the
subject
> of being professionals instead of amateurs. And the reason I'm posting
this
> message here is because I think that many commercial problems we all face
> when we say our service will use Clarion as one of its resources, is
> directly related to the fact that many of us are presented to customers as
> ones that would produce solutions using not aways available software, as a
> free one may be.

> This is something to think.

> Regards to all



Tue, 10 Feb 2004 06:06:48 GMT  
 Why everything got to be free?
I do not believe there is such a thing as a free lunch.
But a lot of the basic requirements to develop a diversity of
Projects, either has to be developed or purchased as a third party
add on.
There are RADs out there that Include most of these requirements
as part of there base package.
After all doesn't RAD stand for Rapid Application Development.
Not Rapid Account Depletion.
My $0.02 worth.
Peter


Quote:
> Fellows,

> I read in so many messages that one need a piece of software for some
> purpose, and at the end, the great majority of them has a line stating
that
> it would be nice if it were free, etc...

> I suggest these "wanna everything free" guys to consider the fact that,
> having to pay for software can be turned into a push in what regards to
> making money.

> Last year I gave a speech at Brasil's Devcon where I approached the
subject
> of being professionals instead of amateurs. And the reason I'm posting
this
> message here is because I think that many commercial problems we all face
> when we say our service will use Clarion as one of its resources, is
> directly related to the fact that many of us are presented to customers as
> ones that would produce solutions using not aways available software, as a
> free one may be.

> This is something to think.

> Regards to all



Wed, 11 Feb 2004 17:34:37 GMT  
 Why everything got to be free?
On Sat, 25 Aug 2001 19:34:37 +1000, "Peter"

Quote:

>I do not believe there is such a thing as a free lunch.
>But a lot of the basic requirements to develop a diversity of
>Projects, either has to be developed or purchased as a third party
>add on.
>There are RADs out there that Include most of these requirements
>as part of there base package.
>After all doesn't RAD stand for Rapid Application Development.
>Not Rapid Account Depletion.

Hi Peter,

A valid point. But it is a Glass half full/empty issue.

With the other RAD solutions and all of their built in "base features"
you are stuck with their way of doing things. Period. The Clarion
method allows you to use solutions tailored to your taste. Much
preferable IMNSHO. Yes you pay a little more, but what you get at that
higher price is extreme flexibility.

Best Regards
Richard

The AppInit Template Set

www.powertech.no/~sylkie



Wed, 11 Feb 2004 19:51:46 GMT  
 Why everything got to be free?
But my point is that I see so much development being stuck bucause a few
bucks that I think it's not worthy.

And the comcept of few bucks here takes into account, the amount of money
that's required for you to implement some real nice and useful ability into
the program (which is a consequence of the servive we all offer to
customers), compared to the amount of money we're going to charge from the
customer.

I think that the real problem appears when we have to produce some program
to demonstrato to a customer, and that program requires some special feature
that'll be only available if we use some commercial template. But if we
approach the solution to this catch-22 situation from the same commercial
side, we'll be able to present the potential customer, a working model that
doesn't implement all the requirements.

And consider the fact that many of these "requirements" are visual or
interface relatade, and doesn't have a real impact on the program's
functionality, which is, at the end of every day, do correct math.

We need to find a way to let novice programmers how to deal with such
situations. This way, they'd have much more fast turn-around times, and
maybe be more profitable with Clarion, which, in effect, would result in a
stronger Clarion market.

Any ideas?



Thu, 12 Feb 2004 00:02:42 GMT  
 Why everything got to be free?
Not quite so Richard.
I use another RAD that let's me do as little or as much
customisation as I require.
It really is Horses for Courses.
Each and all has it's good and bad point's.
Whilst I like Clarion and will continue to use it to fulfil current project
commitments.
I find myself gradually moving away from It, One of the reason's is exactly
what we have been discussing.
It seems that Soft Velocity rightly or wrongly want to establish themselves
in the High end of the Corporate Market, That is quite obvious by there
pricing strategy.
I hope they succeed.
But the fact is that the Majority of people I deal with at a Corporate
level here in OZ  think Clarion is a Musical Instrument.

regards Peter


Quote:
> On Sat, 25 Aug 2001 19:34:37 +1000, "Peter"

> >I do not believe there is such a thing as a free lunch.
> >But a lot of the basic requirements to develop a diversity of
> >Projects, either has to be developed or purchased as a third party
> >add on.
> >There are RADs out there that Include most of these requirements
> >as part of there base package.
> >After all doesn't RAD stand for Rapid Application Development.
> >Not Rapid Account Depletion.

> Hi Peter,

> A valid point. But it is a Glass half full/empty issue.

> With the other RAD solutions and all of their built in "base features"
> you are stuck with their way of doing things. Period. The Clarion
> method allows you to use solutions tailored to your taste. Much
> preferable IMNSHO. Yes you pay a little more, but what you get at that
> higher price is extreme flexibility.

> Best Regards
> Richard

> The AppInit Template Set

> www.powertech.no/~sylkie



Thu, 12 Feb 2004 02:03:49 GMT  
 Why everything got to be free?
Hi Gustavo,

How about
http://web.starlinx.com/jean-marc/wildwild.htm
and
http://home5.inet.tele.dk/gandalf/
and
http://www.authord.com/Clarion/
for example.

Also read some of my responses below....

--
Regards,
Earl R. Coker
Buy the System, Gain the Knowledge.
Sales and Business Management Systems.
www.kwiksystems.com


Quote:
> But my point is that I see so much development being stuck bucause a few
> bucks that I think it's not worthy.

> And the comcept of few bucks here takes into account, the amount of money
> that's required for you to implement some real nice and useful ability
into
> the program (which is a consequence of the service we all offer to
> customers), compared to the amount of money we're going to charge from the
> customer.

> I think that the real problem appears when we have to produce some program
> to demonstrate to to a customer, and that program requires some special
feature
> that'll be only available if we use some commercial template. But if we
> approach the solution to this catch-22 situation from the same commercial
> side, we'll be able to present the potential customer, a working model
that
> doesn't implement all the requirements.

Most of the 3rd party people have demo's but the Client/Customer can NOT
visualize what that demo shows as a function included in another/your
application.

I am coping with that type of thing right now.  This potential customer
wants to
look up their customers by phone number and also has certain stuff about the
way
the app handles customer pricing, inventory, etc done (defaulted) in a
certain way .

Why???  Cause he saw some one elses app do it that way and it's ALL HE KNOWS
and he is to damned lazy to learn a slightly different way much more
flexible way.
Many of his "requirements" are even the requirements that are commonly used
in a DOS interface with function keys and/or short-cut keys.

So I am making a new "special" demo for him that uses those methods but
still uses the
mouse to navigate the applications user interface.  If if were't for Clarion
being easy
to use for app maintanance like it is, doing that "new version" would be
more
difficult than it is worth.  Another advantage is that once I make those
changes,
I believe I will have another "version" for several other market niches.
<g>

There is a local store called Farm & Fleet that I have approached several
times to use
my auto service software for their auto and small engine (lawn care) service
departments.
They were real cold about it.  I was in there the other day and they had
some new PC's
on the sales counter and the employees were playing with the programs on it.
I watched
a while.  <g>  They apparently got a new Windows app (written in something)
that is clunky
as h-ll IMNSHO.  It has no "flow" to it that I could see.  It is just a
bunch of "utilities" that
get called from buttons (DOS style) and they did not appear to be fully
integrated.

Oh well...  I think they wrote it themselves since they have their own IT
department and all
of their stores are on line to their mainframe at the home office.
Such is app development.  <G>

Quote:
> And consider the fact that many of these "requirements" are visual or
> interface related, and doesn't have a real impact on the program's
> functionality, which is, at the end of every day, do correct math.

The above is a big concern every time I talk to a potential customer.  I
don't know
how many times the "standard" way a Clarion apps user interface
(browse form, browse form, browse form)
worked was THE reason why a potential customer "did not like" or "could not
use"
or "refused to learn" the new Clarion app.  Having 3 or 4 screens up inside
an application
seems to confuse the h-ll out of a LOT of fairly intelligent people for some
reason or other.
And... I have been told that one h-ll of a lot of times.  So I am now
implementing EIP
so they can use either browse-form or EIP at will.

I have come to the conclusion that most people are, for the most part, are
just plain...
well I guess I had better be "polite" and not say what that conclusion is.
<g>

- Show quoted text -

Quote:
> We need to find a way to let novice programmers how to deal with such
> situations. This way, they'd have much more fast turn-around times, and
> maybe be more profitable with Clarion, which, in effect, would result in a
> stronger Clarion market.

> Any ideas?



Fri, 13 Feb 2004 00:36:51 GMT  
 Why everything got to be free?
Now that's some nice stuff!


Sat, 14 Feb 2004 05:43:24 GMT  
 
 [ 14 post ] 

 Relevant Pages 

1. Why am I getting bind errors?

2. ERROR 48 - Why am I getting it?

3. why am i getting processor stack fault error?

4. Why am I getting a NaN?

5. Newbe help : Why am I getting this output ?!?

6. almost EVERYTHING ABOUT GETTING FTNCHEK

7. The Smalltalk Store: Why we've been slow, and why we're getting better

8. why why why oh why why baby

9. Into what am I getting?

10. I am getting THISTHREADACTIVE error (lots of them)

11. I Am Getting Fed Up With Clarion

12. how to compile and a set of .prg file I am getting this warning

 

 
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software