TPS file performance problems & missing message thread 
Author Message
 TPS file performance problems & missing message thread

Back on June 24th I posted a message about performance problems I have been
experiencing with TPS files when shared on a Windows 2000 server and access
from another Win2000 pc.  For some reason I can't seem to locate the
original message thread on the newsgroup. It was there for several days and
some folks kindly offered some ideas.  Now it looks like it's been removed,
or my news reader is behaiving strangely.  Does anyone else still see it, or
does SoftVelocity remove topics that it doesn't like??  This isn't the first
time I've seen this happen, it may well be a synchronization issue, but that
seems unlikely.  If anyone can enlighten me on this I would appreciate the
insight.  Thanks.

Back to the TPS problem... I've done more testing and I continue to
experience problems.  The TPS file performs 10 to 100 times slower when only
two users are accessing the file simultaneously.  The performance drop off
is dramaticly when user two connects to the db (even when one user isn't
doing anything).  Jim Kane (Team SoftVelocity??) suggested that the problem
was related to Oplocks with NT/2000.  I did some research on Oplocks at
Microsoft and learned a bit.  Unfortunately, the documentation available is
limited to the Registry options and setting values.  There was very little
available on troubleshooting specific performance problems (not surprisingly
since this is likely a TPS driver issue, and for a change not an MS issue).
I tested a number of options, both with the server and the client... I was
successful at making it worse, but not better.  Does anyone have more any
suggestions?

SoftVelocity -- It seems sort of ridiculous that the highly hyped TPS driver
performs so incredibly poorly in a situation it should excel at -- i.e., two
high performance Win2K PCs (PIII w/ 256Mb RAM) accessing a small shared TPS
file (<500K) on a 10Mb 10BaseT single segment network.  Highly frustrating.
Time for a fix, or guidance on a workaround, SoftVelocity!



Thu, 18 Dec 2003 18:09:06 GMT  
 TPS file performance problems & missing message thread

Quote:

> Back on June 24th I posted a message about performance problems I have been
> experiencing with TPS files when shared on a Windows 2000 server and access
> from another Win2000 pc.  For some reason I can't seem to locate the
> original message thread on the newsgroup. It was there for several days and
> some folks kindly offered some ideas.  Now it looks like it's been removed,
> or my news reader is behaiving strangely.  Does anyone else still see it, or
> does SoftVelocity remove topics that it doesn't like??  This isn't the first
> time I've seen this happen, it may well be a synchronization issue, but that
> seems unlikely.  If anyone can enlighten me on this I would appreciate the
> insight.  Thanks.

I see it - but only until tomorrow :-) Why?
Because my news reader is setup to remove all messages older then eight days.
Maybe your OE keeps them only for a week or even less. Check your OE settings.

Quote:
> Back to the TPS problem... I've done more testing and I continue to
> experience problems.  The TPS file performs 10 to 100 times slower when only
> two users are accessing the file simultaneously.  The performance drop off
> is dramaticly when user two connects to the db (even when one user isn't
> doing anything).  Jim Kane (Team SoftVelocity??) suggested that the problem
> was related to Oplocks with NT/2000.  I did some research on Oplocks at
> Microsoft and learned a bit.  Unfortunately, the documentation available is
> limited to the Registry options and setting values.  There was very little
> available on troubleshooting specific performance problems (not surprisingly
> since this is likely a TPS driver issue, and for a change not an MS issue).
> I tested a number of options, both with the server and the client... I was
> successful at making it worse, but not better.  Does anyone have more any
> suggestions?

Have you now an idea, why the hourly rates of seasoned network engineers are
such high? I'm sure these problems are less related with the TPS driver and
more related with a weak network. This shows not only the wrong OP lock settings.
You can pay for the network knowledge or invest some of your time and search
yourself for tips in the SV news groups, the SV FAQs, etc.
Searching in the web with google may be also useful.

Regards

JB



Thu, 18 Dec 2003 19:06:44 GMT  
 TPS file performance problems & missing message thread
Jeff,

Just so I understand - You used the documented MS registry entries and
turned oplocks OFF on both the server and workstation and it still is
performing poorly?

Al



Thu, 18 Dec 2003 20:29:21 GMT  
 TPS file performance problems & missing message thread
I believe so, but it's certainly possible that I did something wrong.

Opportunistic Locking in Windows 2000
   HKEY_Local_Machine\System\CurrentControlSet\Services\MRXSmb\Parameters\
   OplocksDisable REG_DWORD
   Default: 0 (not disabled)

I tried both 0 and 1 on both Win2K workstations (one functioning as the
server).

I also tried the following on both machines including the Win2K machine
functioning as the server.

HKEY_Local_Machine\System\CurrentControlSet\Services\LanmanServer\Parameters
\
   EnableOplocks REG_DWORD
   Default: 1 (True)

Again I tried both 0 and 1 settings.

Finally, I played with the MaxLinkDelay setting which defaults to 60.  I
tried settings of 0 and 2.

It would be a great help if someone could share the specific settings that
should fix the problem.  It's possible that I did something wrong in the
process of editing the registries of the two machines, after a while of
testing many combinations it's difficult to be certain of what been done and
not.  Thanks.

Jeff


Quote:
> Jeff,

> Just so I understand - You used the documented MS registry entries and
> turned oplocks OFF on both the server and workstation and it still is
> performing poorly?

> Al



Fri, 19 Dec 2003 06:07:11 GMT  
 TPS file performance problems & missing message thread
Jeff,

I searched the MS Site and found article Q296264 which it appears you
found too.  I agree that OpLocksDisable should be 1 and EnableOplocks
should be 0.  The other entries appear to have meaning only if Oplocks
are enabled.

I have to agree with you regarding poor TPS performance being a very
serious issue on the NT/Win2000 platform.  It would be nice if we heard
something from SV regarding this issue since they stand to gain a lot
and (hopefully) have more resources to bring to bear to find a
solution.  IMO, it's disingenous to dismiss the problem out of hand as a
"MS problem" and leave the developer's twisting in the wind to find a
solution on their own.  Although "conventional wisdom" says it is a MS
problem and turning off OpLocks "fixes" the problem, apparently, in
spite of best efforts, it doesn't always resolve the problem.  

I am a die-hard Novell fan and simply don't have the same problem on
that platform but am dreading the day when a client announces they are
switching to NT/2000 and I WILL have to address the issue.  One approach
might of course be to abandon TPS and switch to SQL/Interbase/etc as the
"engine".

Couple of futher thoughts for your consideration:  You might verify that
the Win2000 installation has all the service patches applied and you
might try a "true" Win2000 server instead of Win2000 workstation running
Peer-to-peer.  It may be that Win2000 server works completely
differently than Win2000 workstation in this matter.

Good Luck.

Al



Fri, 19 Dec 2003 06:48:39 GMT  
 TPS file performance problems & missing message thread

FYI, before you start damning SV:  I'm using TPS files on W2K servers and the performance is great.  The stability is better than NT and the wait times for data is negligible.  The system uses a PII 350  w/128 MB RAM, W2K server with no modifications to the registry, a Cisco Router, 6 local concurrent users, one remote user coming in via DSL internet, 14,000 records, several joins and no hiccups and no delays.
Dwight Gaut
Computer Services | LAWDESK COMPUTERS



Fri, 19 Dec 2003 08:47:02 GMT  
 TPS file performance problems & missing message thread
Jeff,


Quote:
> Back on June 24th I posted a message about performance problems I have
been
> experiencing with TPS files when shared on a Windows 2000 server and
access
> from another Win2000 pc.  For some reason I can't seem to locate the
> original message thread on the newsgroup. It was there for several days
and
> some folks kindly offered some ideas.  Now it looks like it's been
removed,
> or my news reader is behaiving strangely.  Does anyone else still see it,
or
> does SoftVelocity remove topics that it doesn't like??  This isn't the
first
> time I've seen this happen, it may well be a synchronization issue, but
that
> seems unlikely.  If anyone can enlighten me on this I would appreciate the
> insight.  Thanks.

A bit paranoid? <g>  SV does not remove postings, never have to my
knowledge.  Even the prior company TS didn't remove messages referring to CW
products directly.
The biggest problem with TPS files is the lack of dev's or end-users setting
up their network properly or a network with hardware problems.  Time and
Time again, TPS files are questioned and performance issues are brought up.
I have hundreds of clients using TPS files without a problem (until
something goes wrong with their LAN, of course)

I know of over a dozen things that can cause the issues you are mentioning,
and all the solutions are in these NG's if you search it.  The obvious ones
have already been mentioned to you.  Others can be anti-virus programs,
screen savers, bad NIC's, defective cabling in LAN, bad Hub, too many net
protocols, etc.

BTW, comp.lang.clarion is not owned or monitored by SV, so they can't remove
messages from this NG, even if they tried.
Mentions of products like Windev, won't get your posting removed. Ask
Hans.<seg>

Doug



Fri, 19 Dec 2003 11:44:15 GMT  
 TPS file performance problems & missing message thread
I suppose was a bit paranoid.  Thanks for the info and advice.  I will
continue to test and search the NGs for possible solutions.

Best regards,
Jeff


Quote:
> Jeff,



> > Back on June 24th I posted a message about performance problems I have
> been
> > experiencing with TPS files when shared on a Windows 2000 server and
> access
> > from another Win2000 pc.  For some reason I can't seem to locate the
> > original message thread on the newsgroup. It was there for several days
> and
> > some folks kindly offered some ideas.  Now it looks like it's been
> removed,
> > or my news reader is behaiving strangely.  Does anyone else still see
it,
> or
> > does SoftVelocity remove topics that it doesn't like??  This isn't the
> first
> > time I've seen this happen, it may well be a synchronization issue, but
> that
> > seems unlikely.  If anyone can enlighten me on this I would appreciate
the
> > insight.  Thanks.

> A bit paranoid? <g>  SV does not remove postings, never have to my
> knowledge.  Even the prior company TS didn't remove messages referring to
CW
> products directly.
> The biggest problem with TPS files is the lack of dev's or end-users
setting
> up their network properly or a network with hardware problems.  Time and
> Time again, TPS files are questioned and performance issues are brought
up.
> I have hundreds of clients using TPS files without a problem (until
> something goes wrong with their LAN, of course)

> I know of over a dozen things that can cause the issues you are
mentioning,
> and all the solutions are in these NG's if you search it.  The obvious
ones
> have already been mentioned to you.  Others can be anti-virus programs,
> screen savers, bad NIC's, defective cabling in LAN, bad Hub, too many net
> protocols, etc.

> BTW, comp.lang.clarion is not owned or monitored by SV, so they can't
remove
> messages from this NG, even if they tried.
> Mentions of products like Windev, won't get your posting removed. Ask
> Hans.<seg>

> Doug



Fri, 19 Dec 2003 17:54:27 GMT  
 TPS file performance problems & missing message thread

Since I am not imagining the performance problems, and TeamSoftVelocity already acknowledged a problem with Oplocks, I suspect there is something different about your situation from mine (and the others that have written me to say they too have experienced this problem).  My test network is two PIIIs with 256MB RAM on a single segment 10Mb 10BaseT net.  I am running Win2K SP2 using CW55d and my data files all have less than 1000 records, with a minimum of joins.  Are you developing with CW55?  

I'm not out to damn SV, but I am frustrated.  I am certain there is a solution to this and I looking, rather desperately, for it.

Jeff

  FYI, before you start damning SV:  I'm using TPS files on W2K servers and the performance is great.  The stability is better than NT and the wait times for data is negligible.  The system uses a PII 350  w/128 MB RAM, W2K server with no modifications to the registry, a Cisco Router, 6 local concurrent users, one remote user coming in via DSL internet, 14,000 records, several joins and no hiccups and no delays.
  Dwight Gaut
  Computer Services | LAWDESK COMPUTERS



Fri, 19 Dec 2003 17:58:24 GMT  
 TPS file performance problems & missing message thread

I've had similar problems several times (2000 and NT4 sp6a)
But can anyone tell me why it's slow with tps files and fast with an Informix database,
same app, with no changes to the app and no changes to the server and network?????

Cheers, Jos


  Since I am not imagining the performance problems, and TeamSoftVelocity already acknowledged a problem with Oplocks, I suspect there is something different about your situation from mine (and the others that have written me to say they too have experienced this problem).  My test network is two PIIIs with 256MB RAM on a single segment 10Mb 10BaseT net.  I am running Win2K SP2 using CW55d and my data files all have less than 1000 records, with a minimum of joins.  Are you developing with CW55?  

  I'm not out to damn SV, but I am frustrated.  I am certain there is a solution to this and I looking, rather desperately, for it.

  Jeff

    FYI, before you start damning SV:  I'm using TPS files on W2K servers and the performance is great.  The stability is better than NT and the wait times for data is negligible.  The system uses a PII 350  w/128 MB RAM, W2K server with no modifications to the registry, a Cisco Router, 6 local concurrent users, one remote user coming in via DSL internet, 14,000 records, several joins and no hiccups and no delays.
    Dwight Gaut
    Computer Services | LAWDESK COMPUTERS



Fri, 19 Dec 2003 19:12:03 GMT  
 TPS file performance problems & missing message thread
I would suggest looking at the 10 Mbit cards + hub + wire.  The odds are
good these aren't the newest and could have some problem.

You could, just for kicks, connect the workstation and the server with a hub
all at 100 Mb for less than $100.  A switch instead of the hub will cost you
slightly more but even then you should have to cross $150 to test 2
workstations.
--

- Andrew Guidroz II (GeeTroze)


Quote:
> I suppose was a bit paranoid.  Thanks for the info and advice.  I will
> continue to test and search the NGs for possible solutions.

> Best regards,
> Jeff



> > Jeff,



> > > Back on June 24th I posted a message about performance problems I have
> > been
> > > experiencing with TPS files when shared on a Windows 2000 server and
> > access
> > > from another Win2000 pc.  For some reason I can't seem to locate the
> > > original message thread on the newsgroup. It was there for several
days
> > and
> > > some folks kindly offered some ideas.  Now it looks like it's been
> > removed,
> > > or my news reader is behaiving strangely.  Does anyone else still see
> it,
> > or
> > > does SoftVelocity remove topics that it doesn't like??  This isn't the
> > first
> > > time I've seen this happen, it may well be a synchronization issue,
but
> > that
> > > seems unlikely.  If anyone can enlighten me on this I would appreciate
> the
> > > insight.  Thanks.

> > A bit paranoid? <g>  SV does not remove postings, never have to my
> > knowledge.  Even the prior company TS didn't remove messages referring
to
> CW
> > products directly.
> > The biggest problem with TPS files is the lack of dev's or end-users
> setting
> > up their network properly or a network with hardware problems.  Time and
> > Time again, TPS files are questioned and performance issues are brought
> up.
> > I have hundreds of clients using TPS files without a problem (until
> > something goes wrong with their LAN, of course)

> > I know of over a dozen things that can cause the issues you are
> mentioning,
> > and all the solutions are in these NG's if you search it.  The obvious
> ones
> > have already been mentioned to you.  Others can be anti-virus programs,
> > screen savers, bad NIC's, defective cabling in LAN, bad Hub, too many
net
> > protocols, etc.

> > BTW, comp.lang.clarion is not owned or monitored by SV, so they can't
> remove
> > messages from this NG, even if they tried.
> > Mentions of products like Windev, won't get your posting removed. Ask
> > Hans.<seg>

> > Doug



Fri, 19 Dec 2003 19:47:58 GMT  
 TPS file performance problems & missing message thread
Dwight,

Are you using W2K Server or W2K Workstation running as a peer-to-peer?

Al

Quote:

> FYI, before you start damning SV:  I'm using TPS files on W2K servers
> and the performance is great.  The stability is better than NT and the
> wait times for data is negligible.  The system uses a PII 350  w/128
> MB RAM, W2K server with no modifications to the registry, a Cisco
> Router, 6 local concurrent users, one remote user coming in via DSL
> internet, 14,000 records, several joins and no hiccups and no delays.

> Dwight Gaut
> Computer Services | LAWDESK COMPUTERS



Fri, 19 Dec 2003 21:21:48 GMT  
 TPS file performance problems & missing message thread

I'm using W2K Server and C55ee.  The hub is an older 10 mb variety.

The .exe is local to each workstation.  The server has 3 .tps files, one of which is a superfile.

The time needed to bring up a browse screen is negligible when run locally. When connected through the internet via DSL, a browse screen takes about 4-5 seconds to come up.

All browses are page loaded.  I wouldn't atttempt a file loaded browse over the internet.

Dwight Gaut
Computer Services | LAWDESK COMPUTERS



Fri, 19 Dec 2003 23:56:48 GMT  
 TPS file performance problems & missing message thread
Dwight,

Doing any filtering? This can have a major impact on a browse across a
network.

Like 2 sec vs 45 sec or worse, depending on the file size and filter.

---
Mark Riffey
Granite Bear Development
http://www.granitebear.com

Software for professional photography
studios, cultured marble / cast polymer /
solid surface manufacturers and non-profit
organizations



Fri, 19 Dec 2003 18:44:13 GMT  
 TPS file performance problems & missing message thread
Yes I am, but the default is browse tab has no filters or range limits.
Also, performance is fine over the network as long as the file is being
accessed by a single user (<1000 records).  Performance suffers only when a
second user connects.


Quote:
> Dwight,

> Doing any filtering? This can have a major impact on a browse across a
> network.

> Like 2 sec vs 45 sec or worse, depending on the file size and filter.

> ---
> Mark Riffey
> Granite Bear Development
> http://www.granitebear.com

> Software for professional photography
> studios, cultured marble / cast polymer /
> solid surface manufacturers and non-profit
> organizations



Sat, 20 Dec 2003 00:56:19 GMT  
 
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